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Comments
It is complicated -- first of all, I didn't mean "AU faction" in a derogatory way. I probably have a different philosophy regarding how I envision Xequence to be used, and what the AU standard is mostly intended for in my mind. I see AU more as a way of hosting "tiny bits of music software that each serve a specific, focused purpose". For example, a synth, an audio effect, a MIDI effect, an arpeggiator, etc. (the mere idea of MIDI AUs is already stretching it for me, but maybe that's because I'm old!).
Meanwhile I've always seen Xequence as the "central hub" for making a production, at least on the MIDI and composition and arrangement side. I don't see it as one of the "many little gears of software that contribute to the whole production", but one of the few essential central pieces (think Xequence + AB + AUM). That's not to say that this must be the one and only valid approach or philosophy, but it's the way I designed it and still look at it.
But yes, even though Xequence currently doesn't support any kind of audio hosting or processing, I still see it more on the DAW side. I mean, if you compare it to a synth or a reverb, you must admit that it is closer to a DAW than either of those
I currently don't see a clean vision for using Xequence as one of many MIDI Audio Units in a production workflow. It's more suited to having ALL MIDI of a project inside it. That may not work for everyone or may be too inflexible or cumbersome for others (and I don't say that's an invalid assessment!), but I currently cannot envision it in a different way.
@klownshed and yeah, that is pretty much the only way that I can think of an AU version of Xequence making sense. But then again, that does away with one of the main design goals of Xequence: to have a coherent all-in-one environment for composition and arrangement.
But I do appreciate the compliment on Xequence's pianoroll and controller editor!
To be honest, I had planned to release those editors as AUs, but about at the same time, Atom came along, and that kind of demotivated me regarding the expected competition and further diminishing prospect of sales. It took a funny turn then when Atom had essentially been discontinued for some obscure technical reasons, but yeah, I didn't see that opportunity fast enough maybe
@SevenSystems
There’s probably still time! Atom doesn’t look like being updated any time soon and is close but no cigar. The more I use it the more I run into the limitations (for example not being able to save a Sequence in one host to use in another/MIDI import export — and the lack of triggerable stop/start in AUM).
Perhaps you should come to a deal with @brambos and put a Xequence piano roll into Rosetta. I’d buy that as an IAP :-)
@SevenSystems Well, I believe I understand your perspective now, you basically code what you think fits your workflow. So I guess @wim is right, it doesn’t make sense to try to convince you otherwise, and that’s fair. You deliver excellent products, probably one of the top three IOS devs in terms of quality in my opinion.
It’s just that IOS is full of those small pieces you mention, probably due to the late appearance of the AU standard (or the early inception of music apps on an OS that was not prepared for that). In my personal view (I’m 51) a music app is either a host or a plugin. Period. Anything in between is prone to connectivity, compatibility, or workflow issues. (Yes, I belong to the AU faction 😉)
But I believe I’m too influenced by the desktop paradigm, and maybe IOS will evolve into a very different thing.
Thanks a lot, I really appreciate it. I also don't want to come across as arrogant. I can be a bit stubborn and focused on my point of view at times. (I didn't think I would ever say that, but I got some interesting insights into my own personality recently
).
I don't see DigiKeys as being close enough to something like Xeq, Photon or Atom for my purposes. DigiKeys seems aimed at folks happy to live in exclusively in a quantized world that compose in bits that don't exceed 32 events.
I'd love to see a sort of Xequence AU that has up to say 8 or 16 tracks for managing works-in-progress particularly at that nascent stage where I have several tracks worth of material that I am exploring -- at that stage it is nice to have everything in one place. I had hoped that the AB3/XEQ/AUM combo might work, but the way that state-saving works in terms of recalling the xeq project is either confusing or unreliable.
Unlike @SevenSystems I don't just work on one piece of music till it is done. I tend to have a number of pieces that get worked on simultaneously (and this was even more true when I was a full-time musician trying to be a musician/composer as a job). And oftentimes, I have ideas that I want to capture in nascent form to come back to. A Xeq AU with good state-saving (and MIDI export and Export to Xequence options) would be a dream. Photon and Atom are oh-so-close but each is missing critical features.
I don't see significant difficulty in simply saving the X2 project with the same name as the AB3 and AUM projects, then restoring those if the state save fails. It's 45 seconds setup time vs. 5 seconds. I can live with that. (though I would rather have AU as well)
This is my view of Xeq2 also. However I can see how @klownshed 's suggestion of a simplified one-track version could be popular.
I would like to see a PolyHymnia AUv3 though.
AND I would dearly LOVE a 'Return to AUM' icon in X2.
I know this is possible when using AB3, but adding it in puts too much strain on my Pro.
The issue is that sometimes it isn't clear which the "right" version of the project is. I have ended up with two versions of the file in cases -- and comparing the files to know which is the right one -- especially if you are juggling several projects (or are coming back to it after a long time) is not fun to me and subject to error. Lately, it has been more miss than hit with Xeq project recall from AB.
@SevenSystems FWIW, i just want something that will run inside of AUM. DigiKeys and ATOM serve a role for now, but i am hoping we’ll see Modstep, Xequence and other robust sequencers provide an AU (even single instance) solution so it runs natively in the AUM workflow.
This day will arrive, just hope it's sooner than later
I got into enough debates with @SevenSystems after having a discussion with him about purchasing X1, then decided to go ahead and try it, so I purchased X1 and then trying to wrap my head around the workflow and midi, all the while knowing in the back of my head that it simply being part of AUM would have resolved all the routing issues, yet him insisting that it's not how he wants it to be used.
Then,all of a sudden, X2 comes out, addressing and fixing some of the issues with X1.... He 100% was already working on X2, yet mentioned nothing about it. Better this and better that, but it seems to be the same all in all, which should have been an update rather than a whole new app purchase, in some people's opinions.
I hadn't ever given it a chance after the bad taste it all left in my mouth. I was reading this thread hoping for something to make me want to give X2 and shot.
Now, i find that there are the same debates being had over X2 as X1. Which even more supports that it's basically the same as X1.
Good Luck!
@Breezee I keep up with all posts X2, and I can't agree with your characterization at all. The majority of X2 customers are very, very happy with it, myself included. Wishing for it to be extended for what we see as the usefulness of AU doesn't diminish our appreciation for it as-is in the slightest. And we're not "debating" as far as how I read it. We're "suggesting". Personallly, if @SevenSystems never makes another improvement to X2 but keeps it running, I've gotten more value out of X1 and X2 than I have out of almost every iOS app I have. Maybe you are an unhappy customer, but I don't think many are. Just my opinion.
Sometimes it's the most "stubborn" developers, who stay true to their vision, who make the most elegant apps.
@echoopera great point about "even a single instance!" I never thought about it this way, but yes, a full-screen single instance X2-AU would be a great middle ground between @SevenSystems vision and the vision of those of us who would love to see an AU version. Iit seems like this would keep the focus as the app was intended, would nail state-saving, and (I'm guessing) make things like seemless tempo changing much easier to achieve.
But enough back seat driving for me for today.
Same here, ultra super duper extra giga mega happy customer ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
@SevenSystems :Single instance X2 AU would rule IOS sequencer world! It would knock off the number 1 right now: X2.❤️
Honestly, I'm glad there are a lot of happy X2 customers. If it meets your needs and are happy with the purchase, that's the most important part.
I just can't bring myself to pay for it. Any sort of warning or information from the developer that one was in the works with some extremely loose timetable would have been nice to have, so I could have made an informed decision on whether to purchase now (then) or wait until the new one arrives.
I just can't find enough of a difference between X1 and X2 to justify purchasing it, and X1 workflow doesn't click with me at all.
X3 should be out sometime soon, maybe that will have a better shot with gelling into my flow ~
Sure, I understand this.
I agree with you mostly about Xeq2 being better as a standalone app rather than AUv3, but I switch so often between X2 & AUM, that the blasted double tap of the home button gets really tiresome, really fast.
I know this is where I get told to put it all in AB3 but using the 3 apps together just breaks my Pro's back.
Just to add that I am also one of those...
Dev has been excellent taking on board feedback and user requests and has implemented many of these.
A++
@Breezee : I felt like @SevenSystems was reasonable in how the move to Xeq 2 was handled. He even kept the price very low at first on Xeq 2 so that people wouldn't feel burned and gave numerous warnings that the special price would be ending.
As I said, I am happy that those that bought it feel good about it. Each person has their own conclusions drawn based on their experiences. I was simply pointing out the similarities with X1 and X2 and the conversations around them being so similar in content and tone, and giving my perspective; ergo others will do the same. I fully respect that aspect of forum discussions, and appreciate this forum more than any I have engaged in. Hell, I even respect the developer because of his work and talent, I just wont buy his apps based on my experiences when using them and after discussion we had regarding them. No real harm done. Live and learn.
Another user perspective data point for @SevenSystems...
I really disliked MIDI editors in iOS so much so that I was limiting my purchases to apps with built in sequencers. I tried Modstep, BM3, Cubasis, and Zenbeats. Nothing clicked until X2. Love the workflow and absolutely the piano roll. Best on iOS imo. +1 on your vision of an all in one midi station that connects to all the bits and pieces inside of AUM and/or AB. It’s easy to set up and is as good of a workflow as can be found in the disjointed iOS environment IMO.
Well said! Agree !❤️
He provided an upgrade path to> @ecamburn said:
I too am a fan. Among everything else that is good and well thought out about it, I like the aesthetics. It’s just a pleasant work environment.
But here’s a question: when editing notes in the piano roll is there a way to select non-contiguous notes together? For example if I wanted to select every other note in a stream of notes and move them together. Maybe I’ve missed something.
Thanks for the compliments. Yes, there's marquee select in all editors -- just tap and hold in an empty area to open the selection rectangle.
If you want to select all notes that occur on a certain sub-beat position, you can also just select one of them and then SELECT -> Beat.
Another way to manually select multiple items (without a rectangle) is to enable SELECT -> Add, and then just tap away on all notes you want.
Thank you. I must admit though that the prospect of "just the whole Xequence enchilada inside a single (full-screen) AUv3 instance" somehow got me thinking.
AU's can be flagged as single-instance. Of course, the second you do that though, the cries for multiple instances will be heard for miles. Why? I dunno, but it'll happen.
That's good parenting advice as well.
I can imagine that it might make sense to have two AUs -- if you consider doing an AUv3 -- one of which is of the single instance whole-enchilada variety. Maybe as an IAP for Xequence -- and a slimmed down version that is a separate thing entirely that handles up to four or eight or so tracks/channels and allows switching between "presets" where a preset is a sequence. Or is organized along the lines of clips.
I personally am more interested into incorporating Xequence into the workflow of DAWs/sequencers that I already use than having a Xeq-based DAW.
OK vastly experienced Xequence people. I am returning to your land after thirty or so pages have gone by (many eons in the real world) and obviously the people who like this thing really do. I never made much progress (which is on me), but at this point would value any notion of what you'd consider the very bbst starting point as regards a video or other tut. Thanks much.
Hi Captain 👩✈️
The AudioDabbler’s tut is really basic and informative.🙏😌☝️
A thousand thank yous!