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New IK Multimedia App (mac/pc/iOS/IpadOS) - Amplitube TONEX

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Comments

  • tahichetahiche

    @JoyceRoadStudios said:

    @tahiche said:
    To be honest the fact that all Nembrini presets are set to unusable high input gain where there’s no cleans until you trim the gain is, to me, a much weirder decision.

    That’s true but at least the knobs reflect the behavior of the amp and the design, even if they’re set extreme. That’s the traditional way anyway. The Tonex skins and the rig player are largely arbitrary, but at least the rig player reflects the gain knob properly on the capture. So I think they’re able to map the entire range of the gain knob across the several rigs.

    With Tonex you have a totally clean capture, or a super high gain one, with the knob at noon for both. So that’s silly.

    Actually if you think of the Tonex skins or Thu rig player as a Tonestack or an eq pedal (pre or post), separate from the capture, and applicable to your whole chain then that makes a lot of sense. But an amp face that doesn’t reflect the capture, that’s a compromise, and it has been with th-u since it came out.

    I see what you mean but it doesn’t really bother me. After I realized I take the amp picture as just a decoration, I don’t expect the values to reflect the sound. Imo don’t think you’re supposed to tweak a lot… I’m pretty ignorant about this modeling capture business but it seems to me that the closest to what was captured, the better. Right?. I mean, if I need a bassier sound I should just look for a different capture rather than try to get bass tha5 wasn’t there in the first place.

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @tahiche said:

    @JoyceRoadStudios said:

    @tahiche said:
    To be honest the fact that all Nembrini presets are set to unusable high input gain where there’s no cleans until you trim the gain is, to me, a much weirder decision.

    That’s true but at least the knobs reflect the behavior of the amp and the design, even if they’re set extreme. That’s the traditional way anyway. The Tonex skins and the rig player are largely arbitrary, but at least the rig player reflects the gain knob properly on the capture. So I think they’re able to map the entire range of the gain knob across the several rigs.

    With Tonex you have a totally clean capture, or a super high gain one, with the knob at noon for both. So that’s silly.

    Actually if you think of the Tonex skins or Thu rig player as a Tonestack or an eq pedal (pre or post), separate from the capture, and applicable to your whole chain then that makes a lot of sense. But an amp face that doesn’t reflect the capture, that’s a compromise, and it has been with th-u since it came out.

    I see what you mean but it doesn’t really bother me. After I realized I take the amp picture as just a decoration, I don’t expect the values to reflect the sound. Imo don’t think you’re supposed to tweak a lot… I’m pretty ignorant about this modeling capture business but it seems to me that the closest to what was captured, the better. Right?. I mean, if I need a bassier sound I should just look for a different capture rather than try to get bass tha5 wasn’t there in the first place.

    IMO, the technology is a failed one if a capture can only reproduce one setting of an amp. No guitarist is going to prefer someone else’s exact same settings. So, it’s unlikely that there is a capture that has things set up as you would if you sat down to play through an amp.

  • JoyceRoadStudiosJoyceRoadStudios

    @tahiche said:

    @JoyceRoadStudios said:

    @tahiche said:
    To be honest the fact that all Nembrini presets are set to unusable high input gain where there’s no cleans until you trim the gain is, to me, a much weirder decision.

    That’s true but at least the knobs reflect the behavior of the amp and the design, even if they’re set extreme. That’s the traditional way anyway. The Tonex skins and the rig player are largely arbitrary, but at least the rig player reflects the gain knob properly on the capture. So I think they’re able to map the entire range of the gain knob across the several rigs.

    With Tonex you have a totally clean capture, or a super high gain one, with the knob at noon for both. So that’s silly.

    Actually if you think of the Tonex skins or Thu rig player as a Tonestack or an eq pedal (pre or post), separate from the capture, and applicable to your whole chain then that makes a lot of sense. But an amp face that doesn’t reflect the capture, that’s a compromise, and it has been with th-u since it came out.

    I see what you mean but it doesn’t really bother me. After I realized I take the amp picture as just a decoration, I don’t expect the values to reflect the sound. Imo don’t think you’re supposed to tweak a lot… I’m pretty ignorant about this modeling capture business but it seems to me that the closest to what was captured, the better. Right?. I mean, if I need a bassier sound I should just look for a different capture rather than try to get bass tha5 wasn’t there in the first place.

    Yes that’s exactly right, and this is why you get like a million captures of one amp in the rig player, or several snapshots in Tonex. It’s that amp at that setting in that moment, EXCEPT we don’t really know how the real amp is set because it’s not reflected on the amp head or skin.

    I definitely believe that captures or profiles should not be tweaked, because that deviates too much from the intention. It’s like you’re tweaking the amp but not with its own circuit and schematic.

    The companies don’t recommend that you tweak the profiles. The annoying part is that they give you the “tech” to do it. Just seems like an emperor has no clothes feature set. I do think that some of the knobs actually can make a big difference, but I still prefer to play a capture as it’s presented, except for maybe tweaking the volume and turning up the treble sometimes.

  • BroCoastBroCoast

    I absolutely love Tonex.

    So much so that I put my Deluxe Reverb up for sale. It nails the sound for me, for free…

    I am not having any of the issues described here either. I can run multiple instances into each other with no noise.

    With my monitors cranked I prefer it over the amp. It’s the same, without having to mic it or deal with hum and ticking from the tremolo.

  • JoyceRoadStudiosJoyceRoadStudios

    @BroCoast said:
    I absolutely love Tonex.

    So much so that I put my Deluxe Reverb up for sale. It nails the sound for me, for free…

    I am not having any of the issues described here either. I can run multiple instances into each other with no noise.

    With my monitors cranked I prefer it over the amp. It’s the same, without having to mic it or deal with hum and ticking from the tremolo.

    That’s great to know. I do think there’s something special under the finger here. And sounds just as good as the competition.

    I really don’t think my issues are user error but I’ll delve deeper later. I was thinking maybe my interface or iOS 16 don’t gel with it yet…

  • chowdspchowdsp

    @espiegel123 said:
    @chowdsp did some work with machine learning of settings for Chow Centaur which is what the neural mode uses and had ideas for how to improve it.

    The same in theory could be done with amps.

    Yeah, machine learning for amplifier modelling has developed quite a bit since I was working on ChowCentaur a couple of years ago! Along with a lot of work happening on the academic side of things, the GuitarML project has been releasing some great open source plugins with machine learning models of various amps and pedals, along with developing ways for users to create their own models that can be used in their plugins. Personally, I've spent a lot of time in the past year thinking about "hybrid" modelling approaches, where most of a circuit is modeled using "white-box" methods, and some of the more complicated parts of the circuit can be handled with machine learning. I guess that approach is not as useful for letting folks do their own "captures", but I'm quite excited about some of the possibilities it opens up.

    Actually the new version of BYOD (released this morning) has a couple of modules that are machine learning "captures" of various amplifiers/signal chains, plus another module using the "hybrid" approach, as well as a module that can run certain types of GuitarML models.

  • bobbyj8866bobbyj8866

    I got the Tonex with the 400 Amps, there are truly some amazing captures in there.

    That intermittent hiss is when you don’t own that capture. To me, it was worth the hundred bucks I paid, as I can use it in AT5 on my Mac and the iOS app is just gravy. I used IK jam points for a discount.

  • BroCoastBroCoast

    @JoyceRoadStudios said:

    @BroCoast said:
    I absolutely love Tonex.

    So much so that I put my Deluxe Reverb up for sale. It nails the sound for me, for free…

    I am not having any of the issues described here either. I can run multiple instances into each other with no noise.

    With my monitors cranked I prefer it over the amp. It’s the same, without having to mic it or deal with hum and ticking from the tremolo.

    That’s great to know. I do think there’s something special under the finger here. And sounds just as good as the competition.

    I really don’t think my issues are user error but I’ll delve deeper later. I was thinking maybe my interface or iOS 16 don’t gel with it yet…

    That might be it.

    The difference I am finding with Tonex vs other sims is how it breaks up. It’s much closer to the real thing compared to say Nembrini Faceman which I also like a lot.

    I went and bought a cheap attenuator to see how my AC50 stacks up direct to Tonex. Hot damn, I hope a capture of it sounds that good.

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @chowdsp said:

    @espiegel123 said:
    @chowdsp did some work with machine learning of settings for Chow Centaur which is what the neural mode uses and had ideas for how to improve it.

    The same in theory could be done with amps.

    Yeah, machine learning for amplifier modelling has developed quite a bit since I was working on ChowCentaur a couple of years ago! Along with a lot of work happening on the academic side of things, the GuitarML project has been releasing some great open source plugins with machine learning models of various amps and pedals, along with developing ways for users to create their own models that can be used in their plugins. Personally, I've spent a lot of time in the past year thinking about "hybrid" modelling approaches, where most of a circuit is modeled using "white-box" methods, and some of the more complicated parts of the circuit can be handled with machine learning. I guess that approach is not as useful for letting folks do their own "captures", but I'm quite excited about some of the possibilities it opens up.

    Actually the new version of BYOD (released this morning) has a couple of modules that are machine learning "captures" of various amplifiers/signal chains, plus another module using the "hybrid" approach, as well as a module that can run certain types of GuitarML models.

    That hybrid approach sounds great…it would permit finding one’s own sound in a way that more static captures don’t. Which of the new modules make use of ml?

  • chowdspchowdsp

    @espiegel123 said:

    @chowdsp said:

    @espiegel123 said:
    @chowdsp did some work with machine learning of settings for Chow Centaur which is what the neural mode uses and had ideas for how to improve it.

    The same in theory could be done with amps.

    Yeah, machine learning for amplifier modelling has developed quite a bit since I was working on ChowCentaur a couple of years ago! Along with a lot of work happening on the academic side of things, the GuitarML project has been releasing some great open source plugins with machine learning models of various amps and pedals, along with developing ways for users to create their own models that can be used in their plugins. Personally, I've spent a lot of time in the past year thinking about "hybrid" modelling approaches, where most of a circuit is modeled using "white-box" methods, and some of the more complicated parts of the circuit can be handled with machine learning. I guess that approach is not as useful for letting folks do their own "captures", but I'm quite excited about some of the possibilities it opens up.

    Actually the new version of BYOD (released this morning) has a couple of modules that are machine learning "captures" of various amplifiers/signal chains, plus another module using the "hybrid" approach, as well as a module that can run certain types of GuitarML models.

    That hybrid approach sounds great…it would permit finding one’s own sound in a way that more static captures don’t. Which of the new modules make use of ml?

    Yeah, I think it's got a lot of potential! Unfortunately, the hybrid approach usually still requires some knowledge of the underlying circuit architecture, which the usual "static capture" methods don't.

    Specifically, the BYOD modules Metal Face, Bass Face, and Boutique Bass all use ML models in a sort of "capture" style. The GuitarML model is just called "GuitarML". The Junior B model uses a hybrid approach, and is based on a lot of great research that my friends Dirk and Champ were working on during the past year or so.

  • BootsyBootsy

    @bobbyj8866 said:
    I got the Tonex with the 400 Amps, there are truly some amazing captures in there.

    That intermittent hiss is when you don’t own that capture. To me, it was worth the hundred bucks I paid, as I can use it in AT5 on my Mac and the iOS app is just gravy. I used IK jam points for a discount.

    Hey @bobbyj8866 i just purchase the same tonex that you have. But it doesn't seem to be working on my iPad. Won't pull up tone net in aum and it doesn't seem to have all the captures.is there a trick getting it to work cross platform?

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @Bootsy said:

    @bobbyj8866 said:
    I got the Tonex with the 400 Amps, there are truly some amazing captures in there.

    That intermittent hiss is when you don’t own that capture. To me, it was worth the hundred bucks I paid, as I can use it in AT5 on my Mac and the iOS app is just gravy. I used IK jam points for a discount.

    Hey @bobbyj8866 i just purchase the same tonex that you have. But it doesn't seem to be working on my iPad. Won't pull up tone net in aum and it doesn't seem to have all the captures.is there a trick getting it to work cross platform?

    Have you entered your registration info?

  • BootsyBootsy

    @espiegel123 said:

    @Bootsy said:

    @bobbyj8866 said:
    I got the Tonex with the 400 Amps, there are truly some amazing captures in there.

    That intermittent hiss is when you don’t own that capture. To me, it was worth the hundred bucks I paid, as I can use it in AT5 on my Mac and the iOS app is just gravy. I used IK jam points for a discount.

    Hey @bobbyj8866 i just purchase the same tonex that you have. But it doesn't seem to be working on my iPad. Won't pull up tone net in aum and it doesn't seem to have all the captures.is there a trick getting it to work cross platform?

    Have you entered your registration info?

    i have, i think the problem may be that i had the free version on the ipad. and maybe i need to delete and reinstall from the ik page?

  • richardyotrichardyot

    @chowdsp said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    @chowdsp said:

    @espiegel123 said:
    @chowdsp did some work with machine learning of settings for Chow Centaur which is what the neural mode uses and had ideas for how to improve it.

    The same in theory could be done with amps.

    Yeah, machine learning for amplifier modelling has developed quite a bit since I was working on ChowCentaur a couple of years ago! Along with a lot of work happening on the academic side of things, the GuitarML project has been releasing some great open source plugins with machine learning models of various amps and pedals, along with developing ways for users to create their own models that can be used in their plugins. Personally, I've spent a lot of time in the past year thinking about "hybrid" modelling approaches, where most of a circuit is modeled using "white-box" methods, and some of the more complicated parts of the circuit can be handled with machine learning. I guess that approach is not as useful for letting folks do their own "captures", but I'm quite excited about some of the possibilities it opens up.

    Actually the new version of BYOD (released this morning) has a couple of modules that are machine learning "captures" of various amplifiers/signal chains, plus another module using the "hybrid" approach, as well as a module that can run certain types of GuitarML models.

    That hybrid approach sounds great…it would permit finding one’s own sound in a way that more static captures don’t. Which of the new modules make use of ml?

    Yeah, I think it's got a lot of potential! Unfortunately, the hybrid approach usually still requires some knowledge of the underlying circuit architecture, which the usual "static capture" methods don't.

    Specifically, the BYOD modules Metal Face, Bass Face, and Boutique Bass all use ML models in a sort of "capture" style. The GuitarML model is just called "GuitarML". The Junior B model uses a hybrid approach, and is based on a lot of great research that my friends Dirk and Champ were working on during the past year or so.

    Keep up the good work - I think BYOD is for me the best overdrive on the platform by far.

    If I want to dial a specific sound, say "Freak Scene" by Dinosaur Jr, the Big Muff in BYOD can get me really close. The Big Muff model in Tonex by contrast is horribly flabby in the bass while still having annoying fizzy highs. There's some really good modelling in BYOD which to me sounds head and shoulders above all the other apps.

  • bobbyj8866bobbyj8866

    @Bootsy Do this:

    https://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/ik-multimedia-tonex-ai-machine-modeling-profile-capture-in-your-daw.2379508/page-22#post-35909106

  • bangzerobangzero

    part of the Tonex puzzle may be that with 400 'official' models up front, and practically unlimited user models, IK could not afford to tune the behavior of the skeumorphic controls for each one. they needed a generic solution. so Tonex profiles bake in a particular gain/eq. the gain/eq controls are only intended to vary that baseline configuration. the pseudo-realistic appearance may be particularly confusing for 'real' guitar folks. the knobs look right, but don't work right! i think of the Tonex ui as aspirational. :^)

  • bangzerobangzero

    ps- the full semi-parametric eq controls are perhaps less confusing than the skeumorphic ones. does anyone know whether the gain control does more than boost/cut the input signal?

  • NeuMNeuM

    @bangzero said:
    part of the Tonex puzzle may be that with 400 'official' models up front, and practically unlimited user models, IK could not afford to tune the behavior of the skeumorphic controls for each one. they needed a generic solution. so Tonex profiles bake in a particular gain/eq. the gain/eq controls are only intended to vary that baseline configuration. the pseudo-realistic appearance may be particularly confusing for 'real' guitar folks. the knobs look right, but don't work right! i think of the Tonex ui as aspirational. :^)

    Right. User uploads in ToneX more or less function like the Tonebridge Guitar Effects app.

  • IK_MultimediaIK_Multimedia

    Note there was an update to the iOS version of TONEX this morning.

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @IK_Multimedia said:
    Note there was an update to the iOS version of TONEX this morning.

    I wrote to support but haven’t had an answer to the following question—perhaps you could answer . I received an email that iRig HD 2 will have 40 models free in TONEX CS. But I am seeing fewer…and it is showing that I am registered when I look in the app.

  • uncledaveuncledave

    @espiegel123 said:

    @IK_Multimedia said:
    Note there was an update to the iOS version of TONEX this morning.

    I wrote to support but haven’t had an answer to the following question—perhaps you could answer . I received an email that iRig HD 2 will have 40 models free in TONEX CS. But I am seeing fewer…and it is showing that I am registered when I look in the app.

    Just asking. Are both products registered on your same IK account?

    And of course, there could be a delay until the wheels turn over, between database updates and app updates.

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @uncledave said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    @IK_Multimedia said:
    Note there was an update to the iOS version of TONEX this morning.

    I wrote to support but haven’t had an answer to the following question—perhaps you could answer . I received an email that iRig HD 2 will have 40 models free in TONEX CS. But I am seeing fewer…and it is showing that I am registered when I look in the app.

    Just asking. Are both products registered on your same IK account?

    And of course, there could be a delay until the wheels turn over, between database updates and app updates.

    Yes. They are registered with the same account and both show up as registered when i check their site.

  • BroCoastBroCoast

    @espiegel123 said:

    @uncledave said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    @IK_Multimedia said:
    Note there was an update to the iOS version of TONEX this morning.

    I wrote to support but haven’t had an answer to the following question—perhaps you could answer . I received an email that iRig HD 2 will have 40 models free in TONEX CS. But I am seeing fewer…and it is showing that I am registered when I look in the app.

    Just asking. Are both products registered on your same IK account?

    And of course, there could be a delay until the wheels turn over, between database updates and app updates.

    Yes. They are registered with the same account and both show up as registered when i check their site.

    Have you logged into Tonenet?

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @BroCoast said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    @uncledave said:

    @espiegel123 said:

    @IK_Multimedia said:
    Note there was an update to the iOS version of TONEX this morning.

    I wrote to support but haven’t had an answer to the following question—perhaps you could answer . I received an email that iRig HD 2 will have 40 models free in TONEX CS. But I am seeing fewer…and it is showing that I am registered when I look in the app.

    Just asking. Are both products registered on your same IK account?

    And of course, there could be a delay until the wheels turn over, between database updates and app updates.

    Yes. They are registered with the same account and both show up as registered when i check their site.

    Have you logged into Tonenet?

    Yes, and my understanding is that these models should show up in the list of the other unlocked modules.

    Does anyone else have an iRig HD 2? If so, do you have 30 models or 40 unlocked?

  • Dante777Dante777

    @espiegel123 said:
    Does anyone else have an iRig HD 2? If so, do you have 30 models or 40 unlocked?

    Just have tried to register hd-2 in the app. 30 models are unlocked so far

  • MisplacedDevelopmentMisplacedDevelopment

    I did not know about this benefit, so thanks. I just installed and registered and now have 30 presets. I saw a message saying you get 10 free as standard for registering so maybe those were being double-counted in the promo material?

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @MisplacedDevelopment said:
    I did not know about this benefit, so thanks. I just installed and registered and now have 30 presets. I saw a message saying you get 10 free as standard for registering so maybe those were being double-counted in the promo material?

    The email I received says “ 40 total Premium Tone Models and 20 user-created Tone Models from ToneNET.”

  • IK_MultimediaIK_Multimedia

    Sorry I'm not sure what is happening in your case but IK Support has access to your account etc and will be able to directly assess what's happening in your situation.

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @IK_Multimedia said:
    Sorry I'm not sure what is happening in your case but IK Support has access to your account etc and will be able to directly assess what's happening in your situation.

    It has been a week since I contacted them. Is there something I can do short of filling out the support request form again?

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @espiegel123 said:

    @IK_Multimedia said:
    Sorry I'm not sure what is happening in your case but IK Support has access to your account etc and will be able to directly assess what's happening in your situation.

    It has been a week since I contacted them. Is there something I can do short of filling out the support request form again?

    I just heard back from support. The 40 tone models and 20 ToneNet presets only apply to recent iRig purchasers.

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