Apple's press release about changes to EU App Store

Tarekith

@wim said:
I have a retort to that but I'm gonna leave off before things get too political.

Too late.

wim

@Tarekith said:
Too late.

Too true.

cyberheater

Apple was just forced to crack open its App Store — but the changes are already being called 'hot garbage'

https://www.businessinsider.com/apple-app-store-shakeup-in-europe-triggers-fury-2024-1

knewspeak

@michael_m said:

@espiegel123 said:

@cyberheater said:
Spotify CEO Daniel EK today wrote a blog post criticizing the app ecosystem changes that Apple implemented in the European Union under the Digital Markets Act, accusing Apple of putting forward "a new plan that is a complete and total farce" under "the false pretense of compliance and concessions."

Ek says that Apple doesn't "think the rules apply to them," and he believes that most app developers are not going to be able to adopt Apple's new terms.

Keep in mind that Ek is a direct competitor of Apple. I would take anything that a competitor says with a grain of salt. Ek is not someone I’d be looking to for honest defense of the average person’s interests — or of the interests of creatives.

This isn’t to say I love the App Store eco-system, but the unnuanced views in this thread overlook that there are legitimate issues on both sides of the debate.

Ek also failed to remove white nationalist artists and COVID misinformation from the platform until artist boycotts forced him to do so.

More BS Neo-Lib talking points, keep on the subject, please.

wingwizard

@michael_m said:

@espiegel123 said:

@cyberheater said:
Spotify CEO Daniel EK today wrote a blog post criticizing the app ecosystem changes that Apple implemented in the European Union under the Digital Markets Act, accusing Apple of putting forward "a new plan that is a complete and total farce" under "the false pretense of compliance and concessions."

Ek says that Apple doesn't "think the rules apply to them," and he believes that most app developers are not going to be able to adopt Apple's new terms.

Keep in mind that Ek is a direct competitor of Apple. I would take anything that a competitor says with a grain of salt. Ek is not someone I’d be looking to for honest defense of the average person’s interests — or of the interests of creatives.

This isn’t to say I love the App Store eco-system, but the unnuanced views in this thread overlook that there are legitimate issues on both sides of the debate.

Ek also failed to remove white nationalist artists and COVID misinformation from the platform until artist boycotts forced him to do so.

Plenty of black supremacist ‘artists’ available via Apple etc. Not sure why someone’s political stance should determine whether or not they’re allowed to release music or films etc, sound very fascist. Wagner? Jordan Peele? (Slight difference in talent and cultural contributions aside..) Just don’t buy it.

Not talking about whoever you’re referencing but highly dubious how quickly someone is labelled a white nationalist/supremacist/racist nowadays relative to the reaction to mentally defective goebels level bile routinely spewed about white people/men/straight people etc by people championed as ‘activists’ for equality in popular culture. I mean, the usual reaction to this very type of comment pointing out inequality is evidence of it. It just so happens that I don’t give a Noel buck.

Remember the hyperventilating over that Not in my Town song. Not much chat about the average hip hop lyric from western feminists, uncharacteristically quiet…

For what it’s worth, this isn’t a political post. It’s a diehard apolitical one. I vote none of the above like Richard Pryor.

knewspeak

@NeuM said:

@israelite said:

@pax-eterna said:

@NeuM said:

If I buy a car from Audi I don’t automatically assume I can use Honda car parts on it. Why would anyone make the assumption an Apple device should be able to be forced to run whatever security-breaking app a person wants?

Exactly!

These people are like those that buy a house next to an airport and THEN complain about the noise. The same can be said for those complaining they cannot install what they want. They bought the product KNOWING the conditions, and then start complaining about it. And another analogy, they are the same people who do damage to themselves through their own negligence or stupidity, and THEN decided they need to blame someone else and sue them. Or alternatively beseech governments to protect them from themselves haha!

Oh and on the subject of warranties, afaik, warranties are for the hardware only, and as all these matters being discussed are software related, there are no warranties at all. I believe software has always been an "as is, where is" proposition - IE install at your own risk.

It's not about using Honda parts in Audi. It's about an ability to use Audi compatible parts without the Audi trademark and perhaps 20 to 50% cheaper but the same as original.

Except those 50% cheaper parts will break faster, causing more damage to your finely tuned Audi. Will you then sue Audi because of your own lack of foresight?

Apple has broken countless third-party dongles, that worked well prior to updates, you seem quite anti-competition.

As far as comparing Honda and Audi parts - code is more analogous to comparing who you allow to drive that automobile.

wingwizard

@wim said:

@tja said:
What are you trying to sell here?

When I buy a device, I want to be able to handle it like I want - and install whatever I want.
That is the normal thing!

Yet, knowing that you made the decision to buy it anyway.

Just because Apple like to controls everything, that does not mean that this is the right way and it should be this way.

I don't disagree with you on that point.

Is our brain already controlled by Apple?

I like to think I control my own brain. I purchased my first iPad 2 more than a decade ago. As a long-time Windows guy I was skeptical of the closed architecture, but immediately appreciated the low hassle of it. Since then I've objectively made the decision whether to continue purchasing Apple devices each time. I will continue to do evaluate each, and will abandon Apple in a heartbeat if something I feel is better comes along. You won't find me complaining about the consequences of my decisions as though they were made at gunpoint though.

You're such a nifty guy, most of the time - but then, just accept everything that Apple does?

I don't like everything Apple does. I choose whether to accept it or not with my wallet each time I make a purchase decision, as do you. The difference is I don't expect a government to swoop in and force Apple to compensate if I don't like the consequences of those choices.

I fully respect people have vastly different views on when and how governments should intervene in free markets. My opinions are utterly subjective and I don't expect anyone to share them.

But OK, this will not convince you, so no point in continuing this.

If you're trying to convince me that more freedom to do as I please with my Apple devices is desirable, there's no need. I agree on that. If you're trying to convince me that government should force them to do that, then you're correct, you won't convince me and there's no point in continuing this.

As I've tried to make clear, I'm all for opening up the platform, and wish Apple would willingly go that direction. I think it would benefit everyone. But I'm not going to rant about it as though I'm being abused, when I had every opportunity to make other decisions.

But yeh, we're not going to have a meeting of the minds. There's no reason we need to. Diversity of opinion is good.

I don’t want to add anything to this but I had to say that your last comment ‘diversity of opinion is good’ I couldn’t agree more. People who regularly trot out the word diversity could do with a little reminder of what it actually means as they seem to react with odd tantrums and claims of ptsd when any difference in viewpoint or character, or facts that undermine their own is present.

If someone thinks a group of people of different ethnicities (usually minus one) who all have the same opinions and political stances is diverse, they necessarily treat and see people by race rather than personality. And those poeple are usually the ones crowing most loudly about their opposition to and labelling people for that very behaviour.

michael_m

@wim said:

@NeuM said:

@wim said:
Frankly I don't see the distinction.

Isn't the real problem that too many people are corrupt and that both governments and corporations are run by them? Both are equally open to corruption. Where the pendulum swings doesn't really matter does it?

The only question is whether power leads to corruption, or power simply attracts corruption, or that corruption leads to power. Likely all of the above.

Soon AI will run both. Then it'll get interesting. At least until we all die.

Here's the difference between corporate corruption and government corruption. Companies answer to their customers and dissatisfied customers lead to companies going out of business. Governments are monopolies and they aren't entirely responsive or responsible to anyone. Theoretically voters can vote out the corrupt, but the corrupt system remains. The only way to really be rid of a corrupt government is to get rid of it entirely... and that does not happen easily in "civilized" countries.

I have a retort to that but I'm gonna leave off before things get too political.

Good idea. This thread is already teetering on the edge of that cliff and could easily go the way of similar ones and end up locked.

Krupa

This popped up in a mate’s feeds earlier, seemed like an interesting side road for here…

NeuM

@Krupa said:
This popped up in a mate’s feeds earlier, seemed like an interesting side road for here…!

You should probably include the link where that came from: https://stevejobsarchive.com/

Krupa

(It came from Twitter) 🤘

Schmotown

@NeuM said:

@Krupa said:
This popped up in a mate’s feeds earlier, seemed like an interesting side road for here…!

You should probably include the link where that came from: https://stevejobsarchive.com/

I read through the archive last week. Highly recommended.

NeuM

@Krupa said:
(It came from Twitter) 🤘

If it came from X, then someone should've posted the right attribution.

Krupa

@NeuM said:

@Krupa said:
(It came from Twitter) 🤘

If it came from X, then someone should've posted the right attribution.

Honestly you’re missing the point mate

wim

Dry humor can be tough to detect on the internet. 😂
That's part of the fun. Tossing one over the wall and then watching what happens.

Crabman

edit: nothing to see here…(deleted)

michael_m

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@espiegel123 said:

@cyberheater said:
Spotify CEO Daniel EK today wrote a blog post criticizing the app ecosystem changes that Apple implemented in the European Union under the Digital Markets Act, accusing Apple of putting forward "a new plan that is a complete and total farce" under "the false pretense of compliance and concessions."

Ek says that Apple doesn't "think the rules apply to them," and he believes that most app developers are not going to be able to adopt Apple's new terms.

Keep in mind that Ek is a direct competitor of Apple. I would take anything that a competitor says with a grain of salt. Ek is not someone I’d be looking to for honest defense of the average person’s interests — or of the interests of creatives.

This isn’t to say I love the App Store eco-system, but the unnuanced views in this thread overlook that there are legitimate issues on both sides of the debate.

Ek also failed to remove white nationalist artists and COVID misinformation from the platform until artist boycotts forced him to do so.

More BS Neo-Lib talking points, keep on the subject, please.

The subject was Ek, and considering he did both of these things, how is this BS? As for the “Neo-Lib talking points”, that’s a pretty weird way of describing taking a stance against white nationalism and COVID misinformation.

Oh, and I’ll make whatever comments I want if I think they are on point. Who are you to tell others in the thread what is appropriate discussion and what is not appropriate discussion?

michael_m

@wingwizard said:

@michael_m said:

@espiegel123 said:

@cyberheater said:
Spotify CEO Daniel EK today wrote a blog post criticizing the app ecosystem changes that Apple implemented in the European Union under the Digital Markets Act, accusing Apple of putting forward "a new plan that is a complete and total farce" under "the false pretense of compliance and concessions."

Ek says that Apple doesn't "think the rules apply to them," and he believes that most app developers are not going to be able to adopt Apple's new terms.

Keep in mind that Ek is a direct competitor of Apple. I would take anything that a competitor says with a grain of salt. Ek is not someone I’d be looking to for honest defense of the average person’s interests — or of the interests of creatives.

This isn’t to say I love the App Store eco-system, but the unnuanced views in this thread overlook that there are legitimate issues on both sides of the debate.

Ek also failed to remove white nationalist artists and COVID misinformation from the platform until artist boycotts forced him to do so.

Plenty of black supremacist ‘artists’ available via Apple etc. Not sure why someone’s political stance should determine whether or not they’re allowed to release music or films etc, sound very fascist. Wagner? Jordan Peele? (Slight difference in talent and cultural contributions aside..) Just don’t buy it.

Not talking about whoever you’re referencing but highly dubious how quickly someone is labelled a white nationalist/supremacist/racist nowadays relative to the reaction to mentally defective goebels level bile routinely spewed about white people/men/straight people etc by people championed as ‘activists’ for equality in popular culture. I mean, the usual reaction to this very type of comment pointing out inequality is evidence of it. It just so happens that I don’t give a Noel buck.

Remember the hyperventilating over that Not in my Town song. Not much chat about the average hip hop lyric from western feminists, uncharacteristically quiet…

For what it’s worth, this isn’t a political post. It’s a diehard apolitical one. I vote none of the above like Richard Pryor.

I wasn’t trying to bring politics into it, I was just pointing out the hypocrisy from Ek when he accused Apple of not complying with rules directed at large corporations.

We’re not talking about the type of song you mention above in Spotify’s case, these were songs glorifying Nazi Germany and the Aryan Race, etc. I get that there needs to be wiggle room, but in the case of the artists he took no action on it was bands making some very explicit references to things that I thought pretty much the whole world agreed on should never happen again.

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

knewspeak

@michael_m said:

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@espiegel123 said:

@cyberheater said:
Spotify CEO Daniel EK today wrote a blog post criticizing the app ecosystem changes that Apple implemented in the European Union under the Digital Markets Act, accusing Apple of putting forward "a new plan that is a complete and total farce" under "the false pretense of compliance and concessions."

Ek says that Apple doesn't "think the rules apply to them," and he believes that most app developers are not going to be able to adopt Apple's new terms.

Keep in mind that Ek is a direct competitor of Apple. I would take anything that a competitor says with a grain of salt. Ek is not someone I’d be looking to for honest defense of the average person’s interests — or of the interests of creatives.

This isn’t to say I love the App Store eco-system, but the unnuanced views in this thread overlook that there are legitimate issues on both sides of the debate.

Ek also failed to remove white nationalist artists and COVID misinformation from the platform until artist boycotts forced him to do so.

More BS Neo-Lib talking points, keep on the subject, please.

The subject was Ek, and considering he did both of these things, how is this BS? As for the “Neo-Lib talking points”, that’s a pretty weird way of describing taking a stance against white nationalism and COVID misinformation.

Oh, and I’ll make whatever comments I want if I think they are on point. Who are you to tell others in the thread what is appropriate discussion and what is not appropriate discussion?

Nothing weird about it read Orwell, take a good look in the mirror, it’s censorship the talking point to which I am referring. As for Misinformation just watch the MSM, but you know what I said about that some time ago, fortunately for yourself and others those posts no longer remain here.

kirmesteggno

Do you think Apple used advanced LLMs to come up with the boundaries for their new iPhone guidelines? Basically "Hey Siri, here are the regulations now give me a solution maximizing my profits".

Or why wouldn't one of the richest companies in the world use the best tools (AI) or people (lawyers) to maximize their position? I mean saving a company money is the quality criteria for business lawyers, why would they do the opposite?

I wonder if they have have anything equivalent in Brussels to come up with regulations or to anticipate that others just do their job as good as possible.

michael_m

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@espiegel123 said:

@cyberheater said:
Spotify CEO Daniel EK today wrote a blog post criticizing the app ecosystem changes that Apple implemented in the European Union under the Digital Markets Act, accusing Apple of putting forward "a new plan that is a complete and total farce" under "the false pretense of compliance and concessions."

Ek says that Apple doesn't "think the rules apply to them," and he believes that most app developers are not going to be able to adopt Apple's new terms.

Keep in mind that Ek is a direct competitor of Apple. I would take anything that a competitor says with a grain of salt. Ek is not someone I’d be looking to for honest defense of the average person’s interests — or of the interests of creatives.

This isn’t to say I love the App Store eco-system, but the unnuanced views in this thread overlook that there are legitimate issues on both sides of the debate.

Ek also failed to remove white nationalist artists and COVID misinformation from the platform until artist boycotts forced him to do so.

More BS Neo-Lib talking points, keep on the subject, please.

The subject was Ek, and considering he did both of these things, how is this BS? As for the “Neo-Lib talking points”, that’s a pretty weird way of describing taking a stance against white nationalism and COVID misinformation.

Oh, and I’ll make whatever comments I want if I think they are on point. Who are you to tell others in the thread what is appropriate discussion and what is not appropriate discussion?

Nothing weird about it read Orwell, take a good look in the mirror, it’s censorship the talking point to which I am referring. As for Misinformation just watch the MSM, but you know what I said about that some time ago, fortunately for yourself and others those posts no longer remain here.

Call it what you will, but if you think that it’s only a “Neo-Lib” viewpoint that censorship of those who worship and yearn for the return of the more extreme policies of the Third Reich then you have a very twisted view of the world.

Like I said, what I was doing was calling out Ek’s hypocrisy.

knewspeak

@michael_m said:

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@espiegel123 said:

@cyberheater said:
Spotify CEO Daniel EK today wrote a blog post criticizing the app ecosystem changes that Apple implemented in the European Union under the Digital Markets Act, accusing Apple of putting forward "a new plan that is a complete and total farce" under "the false pretense of compliance and concessions."

Ek says that Apple doesn't "think the rules apply to them," and he believes that most app developers are not going to be able to adopt Apple's new terms.

Keep in mind that Ek is a direct competitor of Apple. I would take anything that a competitor says with a grain of salt. Ek is not someone I’d be looking to for honest defense of the average person’s interests — or of the interests of creatives.

This isn’t to say I love the App Store eco-system, but the unnuanced views in this thread overlook that there are legitimate issues on both sides of the debate.

Ek also failed to remove white nationalist artists and COVID misinformation from the platform until artist boycotts forced him to do so.

More BS Neo-Lib talking points, keep on the subject, please.

The subject was Ek, and considering he did both of these things, how is this BS? As for the “Neo-Lib talking points”, that’s a pretty weird way of describing taking a stance against white nationalism and COVID misinformation.

Oh, and I’ll make whatever comments I want if I think they are on point. Who are you to tell others in the thread what is appropriate discussion and what is not appropriate discussion?

Nothing weird about it read Orwell, take a good look in the mirror, it’s censorship the talking point to which I am referring. As for Misinformation just watch the MSM, but you know what I said about that some time ago, fortunately for yourself and others those posts no longer remain here.

Call it what you will, but if you think that it’s only a “Neo-Lib” viewpoint that censorship of those who worship and yearn for the return of the more extreme policies of the Third Reich then you have a very twisted view of the world.

Like I said, what I was doing was calling out Ek’s hypocrisy.

Whom has created that system that gives rise to your perceived threat, now treat the cause not the symptom, but no you chose to be blind to that.

michael_m

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@espiegel123 said:

@cyberheater said:
Spotify CEO Daniel EK today wrote a blog post criticizing the app ecosystem changes that Apple implemented in the European Union under the Digital Markets Act, accusing Apple of putting forward "a new plan that is a complete and total farce" under "the false pretense of compliance and concessions."

Ek says that Apple doesn't "think the rules apply to them," and he believes that most app developers are not going to be able to adopt Apple's new terms.

Keep in mind that Ek is a direct competitor of Apple. I would take anything that a competitor says with a grain of salt. Ek is not someone I’d be looking to for honest defense of the average person’s interests — or of the interests of creatives.

This isn’t to say I love the App Store eco-system, but the unnuanced views in this thread overlook that there are legitimate issues on both sides of the debate.

Ek also failed to remove white nationalist artists and COVID misinformation from the platform until artist boycotts forced him to do so.

More BS Neo-Lib talking points, keep on the subject, please.

The subject was Ek, and considering he did both of these things, how is this BS? As for the “Neo-Lib talking points”, that’s a pretty weird way of describing taking a stance against white nationalism and COVID misinformation.

Oh, and I’ll make whatever comments I want if I think they are on point. Who are you to tell others in the thread what is appropriate discussion and what is not appropriate discussion?

Nothing weird about it read Orwell, take a good look in the mirror, it’s censorship the talking point to which I am referring. As for Misinformation just watch the MSM, but you know what I said about that some time ago, fortunately for yourself and others those posts no longer remain here.

Call it what you will, but if you think that it’s only a “Neo-Lib” viewpoint that censorship of those who worship and yearn for the return of the more extreme policies of the Third Reich then you have a very twisted view of the world.

Like I said, what I was doing was calling out Ek’s hypocrisy.

Whom has created that system that gives rise to your perceived threat, now treat the cause not the symptom, but no you chose to be blind to that.

MY “Perceived threat.”? What the hell is wrong with you?

knewspeak

@michael_m said:

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@knewspeak said:

@michael_m said:

@espiegel123 said:

@cyberheater said:
Spotify CEO Daniel EK today wrote a blog post criticizing the app ecosystem changes that Apple implemented in the European Union under the Digital Markets Act, accusing Apple of putting forward "a new plan that is a complete and total farce" under "the false pretense of compliance and concessions."

Ek says that Apple doesn't "think the rules apply to them," and he believes that most app developers are not going to be able to adopt Apple's new terms.

Keep in mind that Ek is a direct competitor of Apple. I would take anything that a competitor says with a grain of salt. Ek is not someone I’d be looking to for honest defense of the average person’s interests — or of the interests of creatives.

This isn’t to say I love the App Store eco-system, but the unnuanced views in this thread overlook that there are legitimate issues on both sides of the debate.

Ek also failed to remove white nationalist artists and COVID misinformation from the platform until artist boycotts forced him to do so.

More BS Neo-Lib talking points, keep on the subject, please.

The subject was Ek, and considering he did both of these things, how is this BS? As for the “Neo-Lib talking points”, that’s a pretty weird way of describing taking a stance against white nationalism and COVID misinformation.

Oh, and I’ll make whatever comments I want if I think they are on point. Who are you to tell others in the thread what is appropriate discussion and what is not appropriate discussion?

Nothing weird about it read Orwell, take a good look in the mirror, it’s censorship the talking point to which I am referring. As for Misinformation just watch the MSM, but you know what I said about that some time ago, fortunately for yourself and others those posts no longer remain here.

Call it what you will, but if you think that it’s only a “Neo-Lib” viewpoint that censorship of those who worship and yearn for the return of the more extreme policies of the Third Reich then you have a very twisted view of the world.

Like I said, what I was doing was calling out Ek’s hypocrisy.

Whom has created that system that gives rise to your perceived threat, now treat the cause not the symptom, but no you chose to be blind to that.

MY “Perceived threat.”? What the hell is wrong with you?

Why Canada welcomed one into its Parliament, applauding him, doesn’t that unsettle your sensibilities, or are you blind to that and you have the audacity to ask what is wrong with me.