How do we encourage youthful take up of this hobby?

Fruitbat1919

I pretty much know that the majority of people that post regularly here are of a certain age (50s plus). I’m not saying that young peeps are not on here, but that the majority of regular posters are, I think that’s pretty obvious, if not only by our tastes in music lol.

Like most hobbies that have an aging user group, I do wonder what we could actively do here to encourage uptake in this hobby?

I do think SOTMC and the LPF Challenges help encourage people posting, but is there anything we could actively do to encourage more younger peeps to be active on here and then encourage their peers to try some iOS music making?

What do you think? And no…a grumpy old person comment about life will not help lol

jo92346

Im afraid my comment won't help......

Fruitbat1919

@jo92346 said:
Im afraid my comment won't help......

Make it anyway…will pass the time while we watch the tumbleweeds go by….

Goldiblockz

@jo92346 said:
Im afraid my comment won't help......

2/0 says let your voice be heard

I'm 32. I think it's showcasing contemporary music being made easily and with joy, that will bring younger minds over.

Fruitbat1919

@Goldiblockz said:

@jo92346 said:
Im afraid my comment won't help......

2/0 says let your voice be heard

Say it…say it…say it…..lol

jo92346

naaaa too old and too grumpy. I'll make the kids run away

ecou

Do young peeps use this old style forum or they prefer Reddit style app ? I can't say I have much insight on the matter.

Music is not as important to them. It's another distraction that compete with video game, social media, Netflix.

I think I see a cloud that needs a good yelling.

Goldiblockz

I think a lot of people that are invested in this space have no...how to say respectfully...

No imagination left.

Half the time I'm excited for a release, I'm stoked to learn about the sound and how it's made, but half the comments are about how Drambo can do it already, or that they've owned the synth it's based on for 20 years and how they have all the samples already and tables in Serum for them.

It sucks the mystery out of it, when they're so jaded by the lifetime of spending money on this shit that they forget what it's like to have fun and learn, or empathize that other people can experience that for the first time, even if they did already 30 years ago.

I think it shows in the personality. Nobody in iOS music aside from a few, shows their faces or personalities in their content.

Fruitbat1919

@ecou said:
Do young peeps use this old style forum or they prefer Reddit style app ? I can't say I have much insight on the matter.

Music is not as important to them. It's another distraction that compete with video game, social media, Netflix.

I think I see I cloud that needs a good yelling.

Yeah you are probably right there….I can’t really comment, as I’m pretty much out of most social media and the last time I switched on my Xbox Series X was to play a couch coop game with my wife and then play a film on Blu-ray! Lol

Fruitbat1919

@Goldiblockz said:
I think a lot of people that are invested in this space have no...how to say respectfully...

No imagination left.

Half the time I'm excited for a release, I'm stoked to learn about the sound and how it's made, but half the comments are about how Drambo can do it already, or that they've owned the synth it's based on for 20 years and how they have all the samples already and tables in Serum for them.

It sucks the mystery out of it, when they're so jaded by the lifetime of spending money on this shit that they forget what it's like to have fun and learn, or empathize that other people can experience that for the first time, even if they did already 30 years ago.

I think it shows in the personality. Nobody in iOS music aside from a few, shows their faces or personalities in their content.

Yep, it does become more difficult the older you get to do something different, but I think we are so swamped with the ‘different’ in the days of the internet, that making anything really noticeable new or different is very difficult indeed.

I remember, like many here, experiencing very new and different bands and music - things literally never heard before! But, I do understand your points of how it can be off putting when we say….”yeah, done that….seen that…”

Goldiblockz

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Goldiblockz said:
I think a lot of people that are invested in this space have no...how to say respectfully...

No imagination left.

Half the time I'm excited for a release, I'm stoked to learn about the sound and how it's made, but half the comments are about how Drambo can do it already, or that they've owned the synth it's based on for 20 years and how they have all the samples already and tables in Serum for them.

It sucks the mystery out of it, when they're so jaded by the lifetime of spending money on this shit that they forget what it's like to have fun and learn, or empathize that other people can experience that for the first time, even if they did already 30 years ago.

I think it shows in the personality. Nobody in iOS music aside from a few, shows their faces or personalities in their content.

Yep, it does become more difficult the older you get to do something different, but I think we are so swamped with the ‘different’ in the days of the internet, that making anything really noticeable new or different is very difficult indeed.

I remember, like many here, experiencing very new and different bands and music - things literally never heard before! But, I do understand your points of how it can be off putting when we say….”yeah, done that….seen that…”

I've been obsessed with music my whole life, dabbling in instruments slightly until finally cracking into Koala and more 3-4 years ago at 28.

Given my years I shouldn't be surprised by so many products on the market, but every other release has me going down a historical rabbit hole and reading new manuals and asking more questions.
I'm probably an outlier, but that kind of feverish curiosity can be cultivated by elders.

Fruitbat1919

@Goldiblockz said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Goldiblockz said:
I think a lot of people that are invested in this space have no...how to say respectfully...

No imagination left.

Half the time I'm excited for a release, I'm stoked to learn about the sound and how it's made, but half the comments are about how Drambo can do it already, or that they've owned the synth it's based on for 20 years and how they have all the samples already and tables in Serum for them.

It sucks the mystery out of it, when they're so jaded by the lifetime of spending money on this shit that they forget what it's like to have fun and learn, or empathize that other people can experience that for the first time, even if they did already 30 years ago.

I think it shows in the personality. Nobody in iOS music aside from a few, shows their faces or personalities in their content.

Yep, it does become more difficult the older you get to do something different, but I think we are so swamped with the ‘different’ in the days of the internet, that making anything really noticeable new or different is very difficult indeed.

I remember, like many here, experiencing very new and different bands and music - things literally never heard before! But, I do understand your points of how it can be off putting when we say….”yeah, done that….seen that…”

I've been obsessed with music my whole life, dabbling in instruments slightly until finally cracking into Koala and more 3-4 years ago at 28.

Given my years I shouldn't be surprised by so many products on the market, but every other release has me going down a historical rabbit hole and reading new manuals and asking more questions.
I'm probably an outlier, but that kind of feverish curiosity can be cultivated by elders.

I like that. It’s positive thinking. I suppose there have always been negative elder peeps poo pooing ideas - when I was young and in my first band, an old musician down a pub told us to give up as we would get no where and he’d not even heard us play! Yet my next door neighbour took me fishing and when I showed interest, he gave me a rod to get started and was full of encouragement. Thankfully, I still fish and still try to make music! I do think it has never been easier to get affordable music gear, but we still don’t encourage kids to just get up and give it a go…like the old punk ethic did….

Goldiblockz

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Goldiblockz said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Goldiblockz said:
I think a lot of people that are invested in this space have no...how to say respectfully...

No imagination left.

Half the time I'm excited for a release, I'm stoked to learn about the sound and how it's made, but half the comments are about how Drambo can do it already, or that they've owned the synth it's based on for 20 years and how they have all the samples already and tables in Serum for them.

It sucks the mystery out of it, when they're so jaded by the lifetime of spending money on this shit that they forget what it's like to have fun and learn, or empathize that other people can experience that for the first time, even if they did already 30 years ago.

I think it shows in the personality. Nobody in iOS music aside from a few, shows their faces or personalities in their content.

Yep, it does become more difficult the older you get to do something different, but I think we are so swamped with the ‘different’ in the days of the internet, that making anything really noticeable new or different is very difficult indeed.

I remember, like many here, experiencing very new and different bands and music - things literally never heard before! But, I do understand your points of how it can be off putting when we say….”yeah, done that….seen that…”

I've been obsessed with music my whole life, dabbling in instruments slightly until finally cracking into Koala and more 3-4 years ago at 28.

Given my years I shouldn't be surprised by so many products on the market, but every other release has me going down a historical rabbit hole and reading new manuals and asking more questions.
I'm probably an outlier, but that kind of feverish curiosity can be cultivated by elders.

I like that. It’s positive thinking. I suppose there have always been negative elder peeps poo pooing ideas - when I was young and in my first band, an old musician down a pub told us to give up as we would get no where and he’d not even heard us play! Yet my next door neighbour took me fishing and when I showed interest, he gave me a rod to get started and was full of encouragement. Thankfully, I still fish and still try to make music! I do think it has never been easier to get affordable music gear, but we still don’t encourage kids to just get up and give it a go…like the old punk ethic did….

The desire for the old punk ethics exist in the younger crowd, but I don't think they know how to express it often, or feel shame for doing so. I grew up forcing my way into hobby spaces I didn't fit the mold of, and finding my ways of comfort in them..but I feel it's a lot harder now.
Finding a voice, let alone using it, is harder with social media being as saturated and globalized as it is now. There's far less niche local communities and many more overarching pools. Unfortunately leads to more fragmentation.

There's a rave scene in my city that is mostly a younger crowd, and it's feverish, like, oldschool feverish. They're allowed to fully express their aesthetics, culture and musical taste all in one space that feels communal.

Third spaces are mostly dead, and third spaces to learn about synthesizers and electronic music basically don't exist. None of them think they'll find community or support/friendship through the hobby, I think. Rather hop on Fortnite with the boys

$20 weapon skins > $8000 bleep boops i'll get hazed for buying or asking if i should buy

Fruitbat1919

@Goldiblockz said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Goldiblockz said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Goldiblockz said:
I think a lot of people that are invested in this space have no...how to say respectfully...

No imagination left.

Half the time I'm excited for a release, I'm stoked to learn about the sound and how it's made, but half the comments are about how Drambo can do it already, or that they've owned the synth it's based on for 20 years and how they have all the samples already and tables in Serum for them.

It sucks the mystery out of it, when they're so jaded by the lifetime of spending money on this shit that they forget what it's like to have fun and learn, or empathize that other people can experience that for the first time, even if they did already 30 years ago.

I think it shows in the personality. Nobody in iOS music aside from a few, shows their faces or personalities in their content.

Yep, it does become more difficult the older you get to do something different, but I think we are so swamped with the ‘different’ in the days of the internet, that making anything really noticeable new or different is very difficult indeed.

I remember, like many here, experiencing very new and different bands and music - things literally never heard before! But, I do understand your points of how it can be off putting when we say….”yeah, done that….seen that…”

I've been obsessed with music my whole life, dabbling in instruments slightly until finally cracking into Koala and more 3-4 years ago at 28.

Given my years I shouldn't be surprised by so many products on the market, but every other release has me going down a historical rabbit hole and reading new manuals and asking more questions.
I'm probably an outlier, but that kind of feverish curiosity can be cultivated by elders.

I like that. It’s positive thinking. I suppose there have always been negative elder peeps poo pooing ideas - when I was young and in my first band, an old musician down a pub told us to give up as we would get no where and he’d not even heard us play! Yet my next door neighbour took me fishing and when I showed interest, he gave me a rod to get started and was full of encouragement. Thankfully, I still fish and still try to make music! I do think it has never been easier to get affordable music gear, but we still don’t encourage kids to just get up and give it a go…like the old punk ethic did….

The desire for the old punk ethics exist in the younger crowd, but I don't think they know how to express it often, or feel shame for doing so. I grew up forcing my way into hobby spaces I didn't fit the mold of, and finding my ways of comfort in them..but I feel it's a lot harder now.
Finding a voice, let alone using it, is harder with social media being as saturated and globalized as it is now. There's far less niche local communities and many more overarching pools. Unfortunately leads to more fragmentation.

There's a rave scene in my city that is mostly a younger crowd, and it's feverish, like, oldschool feverish. They're allowed to fully express their aesthetics, culture and musical taste all in one space that feels communal.

Third spaces are mostly dead, and third spaces to learn about synthesizers and electronic music basically don't exist. None of them think they'll find community or support/friendship through the hobby, I think. Rather hop on Fortnite with the boys

$20 weapon skins > $8000 bleep boops i'll get hazed for buying or asking if i should buy

Good points. I'm off to make music lol....

Slush

As far as the dance industry goes, I think 99% of the people who are going to EDM parties don’t realize the DJ is spinning music made by other people than the DJ himself. It’s only the DJ that gets the attention, no one ever talks about the countless producers who make the stuff people dance on.

Fruitbat1919

@Slush said:
As far as the dance industry goes, I think 99% of the people who are going to EDM parties don’t realize the DJ is spinning music made by other people than the DJ himself. It’s only the DJ that gets the attention, no one ever talks about the countless producers who make the stuff people dance on.

Maybe we can project our Loopy Pro Circles onto dance club walls and pretend we are DJs

Just re read that and thought it could come across as sarcastic, which it is not intended to be

Slush

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:
As far as the dance industry goes, I think 99% of the people who are going to EDM parties don’t realize the DJ is spinning music made by other people than the DJ himself. It’s only the DJ that gets the attention, no one ever talks about the countless producers who make the stuff people dance on.

Maybe we can project our Loopy Pro Circles onto dance club walls and pretend we are DJs

Just re read that and thought it could come across as sarcastic, which it is not intended to be

Interesting idea, except I don’t work with Loopy Pro

Fruitbat1919

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:
As far as the dance industry goes, I think 99% of the people who are going to EDM parties don’t realize the DJ is spinning music made by other people than the DJ himself. It’s only the DJ that gets the attention, no one ever talks about the countless producers who make the stuff people dance on.

Maybe we can project our Loopy Pro Circles onto dance club walls and pretend we are DJs

Just re read that and thought it could come across as sarcastic, which it is not intended to be

Interesting idea, except I don’t work with Loopy Pro

Yeah projecting my Logic Pro timelines doesn’t help….I should know as my YouTube videos bore peeps enough showing my intricate Logic set ups lol

Slush

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:
As far as the dance industry goes, I think 99% of the people who are going to EDM parties don’t realize the DJ is spinning music made by other people than the DJ himself. It’s only the DJ that gets the attention, no one ever talks about the countless producers who make the stuff people dance on.

Maybe we can project our Loopy Pro Circles onto dance club walls and pretend we are DJs

Just re read that and thought it could come across as sarcastic, which it is not intended to be

Interesting idea, except I don’t work with Loopy Pro

Yeah projecting my Logic Pro timelines doesn’t help….I should know as my YouTube videos bore peeps enough showing my intricate Logic set ups lol

So, how can people become aware of all of this.
If I think back, how did I got involved into making house music (how it was called back then): I was into death metal back in the 90s and bought an electric guitar as I wanted to play hardrock. Then I got involved into industrial music (Godflesh) and they used a drum machine instead of a drummer. So I bought a drum machine and around the same time house music became real big night over day, I talk about 1991 or so. I threw my guitar out of the window and bought an Emu sampler keyboard and switched to making house/techno, and before I knew I was spending a fortune on hardware synths and sh*t. I had no community, no internet back then, just having fun and producing crap in my bedroom.
So I think it would be a good idea for synth makers and software developers to be at parties and promote their stuff and get people interested into making electronic music. You got a huge crowd and there are always creative boys and girls around who might get triggered to dive into all of this. Bring a little awareness there is a whole industry behind the scenes.

Danny_Mammy

the kids aren't using Ios, they are on the PC making music as it's a free option to software.

also, there is still a strong base of kids just making music on ye old instruments like guitar, piano, singing etc..

Fruitbat1919

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:
As far as the dance industry goes, I think 99% of the people who are going to EDM parties don’t realize the DJ is spinning music made by other people than the DJ himself. It’s only the DJ that gets the attention, no one ever talks about the countless producers who make the stuff people dance on.

Maybe we can project our Loopy Pro Circles onto dance club walls and pretend we are DJs

Just re read that and thought it could come across as sarcastic, which it is not intended to be

Interesting idea, except I don’t work with Loopy Pro

Yeah projecting my Logic Pro timelines doesn’t help….I should know as my YouTube videos bore peeps enough showing my intricate Logic set ups lol

So, how can people become aware of all of this.
If I think back, how did I got involved into making house music (how it was called back then): I was into death metal back in the 90s and bought an electric guitar as I wanted to play hardrock. Then I got involved into industrial music (Godflesh) and they used a drum machine instead of a drummer. So I bought a drum machine and around the same time house music became real big night over day, I talk about 1991 or so. I threw my guitar out of the window and bought an Emu sampler keyboard and switched to making house/techno, and before I knew I was spending a fortune on hardware synths and sh*t. I had no community, no internet back then, just having fun and producing crap in my bedroom.
So I think it would be a good idea for synth makers and software developers to be at parties and promote their stuff and get people interested into making electronic music. You got a huge crowd and there are always creative boys and girls around who might get triggered to dive into all of this. Bring a little awareness there is a whole industry behind the scenes.

Interesting. The thought of looking for actual physical groups of people did not occur to me in the same way as online groups did. Yet, maybe those people may be a more open audience as they at least have got away from the games machine unless on their phones.

Maybe schools would be a better approach… it’s amazing how young kids are learning to use phones and iPads

Svetlovska

Well, @Goldiblockz, speaking as an ancient, imagination-less, withered crone, what I would like to say to all you young people is:

GET OFF MY LAWN!!!

And then round it out with a good witchy cackle.

Now you must excuse me. I can see a toddlers birthday party nearby that has some balloons which need popping.

Gravitas

My answer to the OP questions is "Don't give up".

Create a welcoming space and lead by example.

When someone hears a guitarist tearing up a guitar for the first time they don't ask,
"What model of guitar you're playing" , they ask," how can I learn how to play guitar like you?"

@Slush

.....You got a huge crowd and there are always creative boys and girls around who might get triggered to dive into all of this. Bring a little awareness there is a whole industry behind the scenes.

Also this.

Fruitbat1919

@Danny_Mammy said:
the kids aren't using Ios, they are on the PC making music as it's a free option to software.

also, there is still a strong base of kids just making music on ye old instruments like guitar, piano, singing etc..

Almost a shame that music making on non iOS phones didn’t take off, as most kids now seem to have a cheap phone at quite young ages and then get iPhones when they start earning some money themselves

Danny_Mammy

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Danny_Mammy said:
the kids aren't using Ios, they are on the PC making music as it's a free option to software.

also, there is still a strong base of kids just making music on ye old instruments like guitar, piano, singing etc..

Almost a shame that music making on non iOS phones didn’t take off, as most kids now seem to have a cheap phone at quite young ages and then get iPhones when they start earning some money themselves

i do think tons of kids (i call them kids but i mean kids to young adults) use the iPhone to record and take notes. they just don't do the music making on ios, they export the audio to the DAW.

Fruitbat1919

@Danny_Mammy said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Danny_Mammy said:
the kids aren't using Ios, they are on the PC making music as it's a free option to software.

also, there is still a strong base of kids just making music on ye old instruments like guitar, piano, singing etc..

Almost a shame that music making on non iOS phones didn’t take off, as most kids now seem to have a cheap phone at quite young ages and then get iPhones when they start earning some money themselves

i do think tons of kids (i call them kids but i mean kids to young adults) use the iPhone to record and take notes. they just don't do the music making on ios, they export the audio to the DAW.

I think I’ve read that PC sales are slowing too. I think it would be interesting to know how many kids / young adults have access to a PC and or phones. The ones I know don’t have any computers now, but they all have phones - not that my experiences will bare much resemblance to the majority. I suppose while more young adults are staying at home longer, they may have access through their parents - although this is an international site, so generalisations won’t really work as world wide social and economic situations and hence access to the tools needed will vary wildly.

jwmmakerofmusic

@Fruitbat1919 said:
I pretty much know that the majority of people that post regularly here are of a certain age (50s plus). I’m not saying that young peeps are not on here, but that the majority of regular posters are, I think that’s pretty obvious, if not only by our tastes in music lol.

Like most hobbies that have an aging user group, I do wonder what we could actively do here to encourage uptake in this hobby?

Release a music creation app called "The DAW from 1989 - Taylor's Edition". Most youngsters will blindly buy up anything to do with Swift, and I don't mean the programming language. 😂

I do think SOTMC and the LPF Challenges help encourage people posting, but is there anything we could actively do to encourage more younger peeps to be active on here and then encourage their peers to try some iOS music making?

But in seriousness, I think making music into a sort of immersive game would get younger people invested. Given that it seems the largest form of entertainment these days isn't literature, music, or cinema, but rather videogames, which have elements of all three previously mentioned artforms. Most videogames have elements of literature (captions, script writing), cinematic elements (how the story unfolds), and music (can't have an epic Final Fantasy game without a proper score, can you?)

And no…a grumpy old person comment about life will not help lol

...fuck. 😂

espiegel123

I wouldn’t make any assumptions about whether young people use iPhones and iPads to make music based on participation in this forum. This forum is representative of: this forum. It isn’t representative of iOS users or even iOS music makers.

Gravitas

@espiegel123 said:
I wouldn’t make any assumptions about whether young people use iPhones and iPads to make music based on participation in this forum. This forum is representative of: this forum. It isn’t representative of iOS users or even iOS music makers.

Agreed.

Gavinski

@espiegel123 said:
I wouldn’t make any assumptions about whether young people use iPhones and iPads to make music based on participation in this forum. This forum is representative of: this forum. It isn’t representative of iOS users or even iOS music makers.

Yes, I remember posting something on my Twitter sharing my YouTube viewer age stats, which skew older. I asked whether other people's stats were different. To my surprise they were indeed sometimes very different. Patrick from the GarageBand Guide had a substantially younger viewership for example. There are also a lot of young ppl into Koala - an app that constantly outranks other DAWs and AUv3s in the appstore charts.

JanKun

@espiegel123 said:
I wouldn’t make any assumptions about whether young people use iPhones and iPads to make music based on participation in this forum. This forum is representative of: this forum. It isn’t representative of iOS users or even iOS music makers.

☝️👏