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Comments
You could just use your smartphone as the router connection, if you were away from wifi, I expect.
tried this, pretty sure it doesn't work this way. iOS doesn't create a full connection that can route network MIDI as far as I could tell.
I'm just going to trust Sebastian on this one. If he's excited, then I'm excited.
After checking Link out it looks cool and everything, but really it's only going to be as cool as developers make it out to be. If half my apps have it while the other half don't, this will only just confuse things further.
And what about Michael's incredible sync engine?
There will be a third application developed by Steinberg which connects it to Link, unless you have one of Korg's WIST apps installed, because WIST disables the Steinberg application out of pure jealousy.
Here's a YouTube vid... Apologize if was posted earlier and I didn't catch...
Note is the same vid on the Ableton website...
Lots of infos here...
As it is presented, Link seems a good alternative to Wist, but does it also send/receive some signals to Midi clock ?
What if you also have external hardware with midi sync ?
Maybe their will be hardware including Link technology in the futur...Or a kind of Mi.1 or Puc midi box that will handle this connection to hardware...
What it does not solve is the actual mess with midi sync between hardware and IOS apps...
And we have IAA, Spectacular, midi clock for quite a long time...
Not sure I follow. If one of your devices' apps is controlling hardware via wired midi connection, couldn't Link in the app then send/receive clock with the hardware right along with everything else?
I'm assuming you're talking about working without Live involved.
I have a Korg Volca Beats and when it is in external sync mode, it's transport doesn't do anything, and it is run fully by the app sending midi clock. It would be cool if there was a Link to External Midi app that could translate Link to the hardware world.
Forget multiple devices, I'd be happy just accurately sync'ing apps on the same iPad.
I remember when IAA was going to "solve all our sync problems".
Well, here's hoping - one can pray....
➕ 1000!
@aaronpc
Yes it's for no Link compliant technology, that (I guess) must start first to launch the sync, and then stay in sync with Link.
I mean does Link handle clock with "old" clock system ?
For instance, if you press stop on an external hardware device handling Midi clock (with stop button I mean) will it stop all devices thru link ? (In this scenario I would say no, but if it does not stop, how to have the midi master clock starting the apps Link compliant ?)
Workaround : (lol) put the volume down, then switched of the hardware if you want to leave, make a prayer that the missing initial clock won't freeze other stuffs in the chain...
I hope it's not just a "wow technology : see I'm in sync with everyone that have bought my apps and only them, let's forget about 30 years of midi, and BTW hardware suck, buy 10 Ipad pro, 4 Iwatches, 3 Iphone 6s every year and say thank you"
Even if I do love progress, new apps, etc...No problem to see evolving midi if needed, but, please, first let's be in sync OMHO, and forget about including a new shinny sticker for selling apps that won't be usable in a pro environment.
I also remember some quite definitive sentences from Michael about Wist...(but I understand that Wist might have not been thought in a systemic way, so of course we have the right to change our mind...)
Please read this post and vote :
https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/10689/output-buffer-to-64#latest
10 years ago, we had better latency...(Ok, it was not with only with an Ipad...but still it's less pro now, and I won't speak about mp3 quality, because I start to bore myself, and thinking I'm too old for this s...
)
This only seems that way if you assume we ever had a solution for sync on iOS but:
We never had a clearly defined and enforced IAA sync standard. It works with some apps, with some it doesn't. Garageband doesn't even send any sync information via IAA [EDIT: Correction, as Jonatan will point out in a post below, GarageBand does send sync information, but not every IAA node reacts to it - DM1 for example]. Sure, it can be done, but nobody enforces it. It's definitely not enforced by code.
That's not even officially available and since it's MIDI it suffers from the flaw that on iOS all apps have a MIDI configuration section, which can be misconfigured. And there's nothing Michael can do about this.
Midi Clock is just one technology that Mike's spectacular sync engine uses as well. It's not a product that can be used, but just a technology (like IAA).
So in my view this is a misconception. We never had a working solution for sync on iOS. Link has a really good chance to change that.
Will iOS Daws be able to incorporate Link? Hopefully so.
Currently most iOS daw apps don't allow to be slaved to an external clock and it seems the selling point for link is that any node can change the clock timing. If you can't Link to a Daw other than Live then it will get less use from me but maybe that problem will be solved, Auria has Wist and It's own Auria Link so I'm guessing incorporating it will be no problem.
I'm hoping that it could be added into Midiflow which could then solve a lot of hardware compatibility issues.
This is awesome stuff, that elastic drum video shows just how solid this is. Can't wait, might sell some of my gear and get a push 2.0
I think there is no master or slave in that scenario @Carnbot. My understanding and thus speculation leads me to believe that with Link the participating apps share one common BPM thus following along every change. Say if you have 3 apps connected and you change the bpm in one the other two follow along.
Exactly.
Yes this is my understanding too, but hopefully iOS daws can integrate this easily is my concern. will have to wait and hear what Rim and Mr Bremmers think of it
Actually, Garageband does send IAA sync. Personally I think IAA sync is the way to sync apps running on the same device. It covers everything that MIDI clock is missing. However, the master/slave relationship is not arbitrary, the host must always be the master and the nodes (instruments, drum machines, synths, etc) the slaves. However, there's not many hosts that sends it, and some (at least one that I know of) doesn't send a consistent signal.
I do think IAA sync is quite clearly defined, it's a function through which a host can provide a node with tempo, time signature, current beat position (fractional) and downbeat position. I'm not sure why it hasn't been picked up more.
But as Sebastian said about MIDI clock, IAA sync is a technology, not a product. It has to be put into products, and implemented correctly. (Though a lot easier to get correct than extrapolating a consistent time signal out of a low-resolution MIDI clock tick stream...)
/Jonatan
Jonatan is correct, I was wrong, GarageBand sends sync information via IAA, but some apps don't react to it. I only remembered DM1 not reacting to tempo changes via IAAA in GarageBand and assumed it was because of GarageBand, not DM1. This illustrates another issue with this: from a user's perspective it's very hard to tell which of the apps in question are actually to blame for something not working, which in turn adds to general confusion.
And that's the problem: even if something it clearly defined, it still needs to be enforced.
Reacting to and transmitting tempo changes is one of the core components of Link, which is one of the reasons I'm so excited about and hopeful for it.
Now , maybe the AB haters/naysayers (retronyms et al) will have to get onboard the 'bus or be left behind when the sync party starts...
No, they won't. Link is independent of Audiobus. Audiobus just makes it a little bit more convenient. Ableton has full control over it and Audiobus is not required for it.
If I put my cynical hat on, why is this so different from other attempts to introduce a sync standard - it will still be dependent on each app implementing it (hurdle No.1) and doing it correctly (hurdle No.2), so there still seems to be scope to mess it up, just as much as midi, wist or IAA. Unless I'm missing something? Don't get me wrong, I would love it to magically solve all sync issues, but I am not sure how this differs from previous attempts.
Fair questions.
Not every app, but most of them. And with most iOS music app developers there's a consensus that Sync just didn't work in the past. From my conversations with other iOS music app devs, everybody is really interested in a sync solution that works and is willing to implement it.
Ableton's team. Also, we've decided to help them as much as we can, because mobile music on iOS needs a sync solution.
PS: Don't put on your cynical hat. Let's just try to be positive about this until proven wrong. We have everything to gain.
To counter the cynical viewpoint, which Is certainly valid, I think some points of optimism may be...
This is a new crack at the bat and lessons have been learned about how to aproach it, even if they were attempts by others.
Ableton is a huge name and are clearly showing they want to own this and not just throw another acronym into the mix. Seems like they are putting more of their rep into this than others have. As far as ease of implimentation I dont know specificly but it looks like several tiers of developer have already adopted it, into existing apps no less. It shows that you probably do not have to completely reengineer everything to make it work.
I think it's positive that a company like Ableton are recognising that the mobile platform plays a part in many music makers ideas.
Is Link capable of starting/stopping playback in linked apps, or will you always have to start each one manually?
Incorporating a hardware wifi router inside Push 2: Would be cool.
I can also see some enterprising hacker musician crashing a DJ's network and session, messing around with the tempo and stuff. Music hacking.
What would be cool @Michael, would be a remote, for controlling apps in Link network.