Audio Evolution Mobile DAW

rs2000

@tja said:

@rs2000 said:

@tja said:
@rs2000 We seem to missunderstand.

I think so

This question comes, when you quit the Piano Roll.

While editing, the situation is as i wrote - you can edit notes outside the original region but cannot play them.

It does not help to be forced to exit, expand the region, just to enter again repeat the same.

So, i am asking, what the goal of that construction is.

And if there is no real goal, why it could not be changed - for a better thing to all.

What's wrong with that?
You're not forced to exit the piano roll, that's why you're asked when done editing, and usually you'd create longer clips in the first place: EDIT > Tap and drag to the length you want > The piano roll opens automatically. (make sure the grid is enabled)
Let's suppose we have a number of clips of same or different length within one MIDI track and you're editing the first of two adjacent clips.
When you enter notes in the red area showing the range outside the clip, would you expect AEM to extend the clip length automatically so the clips overlap?

I'm not even understanding what you are saying.

When I would like to be restricted to the initial clip length, the selected region, why should I then be able to edit before and after that clip?
For what reason? That's the question.

AEM is creating a clip with an initial length, that cannot be changed while editing.
You need to leave the Piano Roll to then get asks if you want to extend the clip.
But while editing, I already tried to do so - as I was able to create note outside the original clip.

But while in the Piano Roll, I cannot hear the notes at all, so to be able to hear them, I need to exit the Piano Roll.
That's more than strange!

So, either just create clips of some length and do NOT allow to edit stuff outside of it, or much better don't use such a region or clip length at all, as seen in Cubasis.
You just edit the whole track, without restriction and can hear all notes.
If you than want to split the track into separate clips, you can do so afterwards.

More clear?

The red area in the piano roll is there for a reason: It's the area outside the clip length.
The fact that you can add notes there anyway is just a convenience function to save time: If, while editing, you decide to extend the clip length, you can do so by just adding notes instead of going back and manually extending the clip and then having to open the piano roll again.
Cubasis uses the same "clip length" principle, except that you can only change the clip length in the arranger window. If you prefer the Cubasis way, just don't put any notes on the red area im AEM's piano roll.
@dwrae
I agree however that the notes placed in the red area should sound as well, not only after exiting the piano roll and extending the clip.

Janosax

@gregsmith said:
Also, can you automate AU instrument knobs? Is that possible on any daw at the mo?

Seems it’s possible on this promising AEM app, on my screenshot it’s Grind Audio Damage AU fx frequency knob automated. It’s editable 100%. But copy paste curves portions is a must have. Hope it’s possible.

Exports seems to work well. Real freeze function is desired too. Also, sometimes first midi parts notes from ModelD don’t play well and gets stuck. Have to try this with other AU.

gregsmith

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:
Also, can you automate AU instrument knobs? Is that possible on any daw at the mo?

Seems it’s possible on this promising AEM app, on my screenshot it’s Grind Audio Damage AU fx frequency knob automated. It’s editable 100%. But copy paste curves portions is a must have. Hope it’s possible.

Exports seems to work well. Real freeze function is desired too. Also, sometimes first midi parts notes from ModelD don’t play well and gets stuck. Have to try this with other AU.

Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Janosax

@gregsmith said:

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:
Also, can you automate AU instrument knobs? Is that possible on any daw at the mo?

Seems it’s possible on this promising AEM app, on my screenshot it’s Grind Audio Damage AU fx frequency knob automated. It’s editable 100%. But copy paste curves portions is a must have. Hope it’s possible.

Exports seems to work well. Real freeze function is desired too. Also, sometimes first midi parts notes from ModelD don’t play well and gets stuck. Have to try this with other AU.

Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Just noticed like you it don’t works with AU instruments knobs, in this case with Ruismaker, could be so nice if it works too!!

Matt_Fletcher_2000

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:
Also, can you automate AU instrument knobs? Is that possible on any daw at the mo?

Seems it’s possible on this promising AEM app, on my screenshot it’s Grind Audio Damage AU fx frequency knob automated. It’s editable 100%. But copy paste curves portions is a must have. Hope it’s possible.

Exports seems to work well. Real freeze function is desired too. Also, sometimes first midi parts notes from ModelD don’t play well and gets stuck. Have to try this with other AU.

Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Just noticed like you it don’t works with AU instruments knobs, in this case with Ruismaker, could be so nice if it works too!!

Really? No automation of AU instruments? That’s a bit disapponting. Are we sure? Does it depend on which AU instrument it is?

Janosax

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:
Also, can you automate AU instrument knobs? Is that possible on any daw at the mo?

Seems it’s possible on this promising AEM app, on my screenshot it’s Grind Audio Damage AU fx frequency knob automated. It’s editable 100%. But copy paste curves portions is a must have. Hope it’s possible.

Exports seems to work well. Real freeze function is desired too. Also, sometimes first midi parts notes from ModelD don’t play well and gets stuck. Have to try this with other AU.

Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Just noticed like you it don’t works with AU instruments knobs, in this case with Ruismaker, could be so nice if it works too!!

Really? No automation of AU instruments? That’s a bit disapponting. Are we sure? Does it depend on which AU instrument it is?

No AU instruments automatable parameters for Ruismaker, ModelD and Reslice in my case.

Audiojunkie

@Janosax said:

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:
Also, can you automate AU instrument knobs? Is that possible on any daw at the mo?

Seems it’s possible on this promising AEM app, on my screenshot it’s Grind Audio Damage AU fx frequency knob automated. It’s editable 100%. But copy paste curves portions is a must have. Hope it’s possible.

Exports seems to work well. Real freeze function is desired too. Also, sometimes first midi parts notes from ModelD don’t play well and gets stuck. Have to try this with other AU.

Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Just noticed like you it don’t works with AU instruments knobs, in this case with Ruismaker, could be so nice if it works too!!

Really? No automation of AU instruments? That’s a bit disapponting. Are we sure? Does it depend on which AU instrument it is?

No AU instruments automatable parameters for Ruismaker, ModelD and Reslice in my case.

I’m not sure if I understand what you are saying. Full midi cc automation exists: cc’s 0-127. If automation for these parameters isn’t working, it either isn’t supported by the AU instrument, or it’s a bug. If it’s not supported by the AU instrument, that is not AEM Mobile’s fault. If it’s a bug, @dwrae will want to fix it.

Janosax

@Audiojunkie said:

@Janosax said:

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:

@Janosax said:

@gregsmith said:
Also, can you automate AU instrument knobs? Is that possible on any daw at the mo?

Seems it’s possible on this promising AEM app, on my screenshot it’s Grind Audio Damage AU fx frequency knob automated. It’s editable 100%. But copy paste curves portions is a must have. Hope it’s possible.

Exports seems to work well. Real freeze function is desired too. Also, sometimes first midi parts notes from ModelD don’t play well and gets stuck. Have to try this with other AU.

Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Just noticed like you it don’t works with AU instruments knobs, in this case with Ruismaker, could be so nice if it works too!!

Really? No automation of AU instruments? That’s a bit disapponting. Are we sure? Does it depend on which AU instrument it is?

No AU instruments automatable parameters for Ruismaker, ModelD and Reslice in my case.

I’m not sure if I understand what you are saying. Full midi cc automation exists: cc’s 0-127. If automation for these parameters isn’t working, it either isn’t supported by the AU instrument, or it’s a bug. If it’s not supported by the AU instrument, that is not AEM Mobile’s fault. If it’s a bug, @dwrae will want to fix it.

Yes it should be doable via CC, but AU instruments can lacks some documentation about CC knobs implementation. Also, CC automation for AU parameters should be drawn at first? Best way for automation is to hear what is done, by moving knob directly from AU GUI, then edit after automation recording. It’s already possible with AU FXs, why not AU instruments? It’s certainly feasible.

dwrae

Guys, I'll come back to all of this later. First I have some bugs to fix!

Telstar5

I wish Doug Woods would do a video tutorial on this also.@thesoundtestroom

dwrae

@rs2000 said:
In other apps, while you zoom in with two fingers, you can also drag left or right.
In AEM, you can't.

Solved for next release

dwrae

@rs2000 said:
@dwrae
In the piano roll, the dynamic note length is no more independent from the grid setting.
Notes should rather be created with their length imposed by the currently visible grid width.

Solved for next release

dwrae

@gregsmith said:
Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Next version will have parameter automation for au instruments as well

dwrae

@Janosax said:
Also, I think on iPhone timeline info takes too much space. Do you think it can be improved by diminishing its height or or by displaying only bars or mins via preferences options?

Making the timeline info smaller would make it very hard to hit it reliably. Please note that there are markers on that space that can be moved. Also double-tapping that area will pop-up the marker dialog, which all becomes harder when it gets smaller.

dwrae

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:
4. The new ‘virtual midi input’ port for AEMS (it now has its own port that other apps can connect to) doesn’t record midi as far as I can make out. It listens for it, and you can hear the midi being played by the instrument assigned to the track. But after you check what’s been recorded - no midi is there in the midi clip.

I tested with Xequence and with a MIDI track or instrument track with the input set to virtual MIDI and the MIDI notes were recorded fine here. Perhaps more related to the Roli issues?

dwrae

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:
1. ‘Midi Instrument Tracks’ are not recording multi-channel midi. Only ‘Midi tracks’ are. This explains why those hosting MPE AUs in AEM like Roli Noise are not hearing the Seaboard playing / recording correctly.

Next version has an option in the MIDI input dialog to keep the MIDI channel information. I am bit reluctant to always do this. When exporting all MIDI tracks as a MIDI file for example, they would all have channel 1, which may be not what people want. There are of course other ways to handle this (at export itself), but I cannot overlook all use cases at the moment. The 'Keep' option is off per default for an instrument track and on for a plain MIDI track.

2. For some very annoying reason both my Lightblock and the Aftertouch app are not having their midi notes heard or recorded when AEM is connected to their ‘Lightblock Bluetooth port’ or ‘Aftertouch Source port’ respectively. Pitchbend, Aftertouch and cc74 (slide) are all being picked up and recorded. But just not the damn notes!

This is still in 2.0.2?

rs2000

@dwrae said:

@rs2000 said:
In other apps, while you zoom in with two fingers, you can also drag left or right.
In AEM, you can't.

Solved for next release

@dwrae said:

@rs2000 said:
@dwrae
In the piano roll, the dynamic note length is no more independent from the grid setting.
Notes should rather be created with their length imposed by the currently visible grid width.

Solved for next release

@dwrae said:

@gregsmith said:
Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Next version will have parameter automation for au instruments as well

Amazing!

rs2000

@dwrae said:

@Janosax said:
Also, I think on iPhone timeline info takes too much space. Do you think it can be improved by diminishing its height or or by displaying only bars or mins via preferences options?

Making the timeline info smaller would make it very hard to hit it reliably. Please note that there are markers on that space that can be moved. Also double-tapping that area will pop-up the marker dialog, which all becomes harder when it gets smaller.

With touch screens, tapping close to the timeline would be enough to actually hit it (the touch-sensitive area must often be larger than the actual UI element on touch devices, especially smaller iPhones.)
Tapping slightly below the timeline will still hit it, and tapping a bit lower would then hit the track element(s), for example.
I also strongly believe that the button menu above and the transport bar below can be reduced in height a little bit, maybe 80% of the current height, still remaining usable on an iPhone 5S.
The vertical track size is zoomable on the iPhone, so we're not running into problems IMHO.
Removing the elegant darker window behind the green time/beat counter on the iPhone would open more space for the numbers.

What do others think?

Janosax

@rs2000 said:

@dwrae said:

@Janosax said:
Also, I think on iPhone timeline info takes too much space. Do you think it can be improved by diminishing its height or or by displaying only bars or mins via preferences options?

Making the timeline info smaller would make it very hard to hit it reliably. Please note that there are markers on that space that can be moved. Also double-tapping that area will pop-up the marker dialog, which all becomes harder when it gets smaller.

With touch screens, tapping close to the timeline would be enough to actually hit it (the touch-sensitive area must often be larger than the actual UI element on touch devices, especially smaller iPhones.)
Tapping slightly below the timeline will still hit it, and tapping a bit lower would then hit the track element(s), for example.
I also strongly believe that the button menu above and the transport bar below can be reduced in height a little bit, maybe 80% of the current height, still remaining usable on an iPhone 5S.
The vertical track size is zoomable on the iPhone, so we're not running into problems IMHO.
Removing the elegant darker window behind the green time/beat counter on the iPhone would open more space for the numbers.

What do others think?

+1 GarageBand has a slim timeline, Xequence has hideable one and no issues. AEMS timeline and various bars reminds me BM2 which is far from optimal for iPhone screen space using. Those things are important. 80% seems to be a nice cut.

Janosax

@dwrae said:

@gregsmith said:
Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Next version will have parameter automation for au instruments as well

Cool!!

Audiojunkie

@rs2000 said:

@dwrae said:

@Janosax said:
Also, I think on iPhone timeline info takes too much space. Do you think it can be improved by diminishing its height or or by displaying only bars or mins via preferences options?

Making the timeline info smaller would make it very hard to hit it reliably. Please note that there are markers on that space that can be moved. Also double-tapping that area will pop-up the marker dialog, which all becomes harder when it gets smaller.

With touch screens, tapping close to the timeline would be enough to actually hit it (the touch-sensitive area must often be larger than the actual UI element on touch devices, especially smaller iPhones.)
Tapping slightly below the timeline will still hit it, and tapping a bit lower would then hit the track element(s), for example.
I also strongly believe that the button menu above and the transport bar below can be reduced in height a little bit, maybe 80% of the current height, still remaining usable on an iPhone 5S.
The vertical track size is zoomable on the iPhone, so we're not running into problems IMHO.
Removing the elegant darker window behind the green time/beat counter on the iPhone would open more space for the numbers.

What do others think?

I'm not sure. I like the big buttons for my fat fingers. Maybe a compromise might be to have a "selectable option" for the size or to hide the bar? I use an iPhone 7+ and I can't imagine how those with smaller screens would be able to use the app with graphics any smaller. But then again, I can imagine that they would also want as much space as possible.......so........ I'm ok as long as it's an option that can be set in preferences.

rs2000

@Audiojunkie said:

@rs2000 said:

@dwrae said:

@Janosax said:
Also, I think on iPhone timeline info takes too much space. Do you think it can be improved by diminishing its height or or by displaying only bars or mins via preferences options?

Making the timeline info smaller would make it very hard to hit it reliably. Please note that there are markers on that space that can be moved. Also double-tapping that area will pop-up the marker dialog, which all becomes harder when it gets smaller.

With touch screens, tapping close to the timeline would be enough to actually hit it (the touch-sensitive area must often be larger than the actual UI element on touch devices, especially smaller iPhones.)
Tapping slightly below the timeline will still hit it, and tapping a bit lower would then hit the track element(s), for example.
I also strongly believe that the button menu above and the transport bar below can be reduced in height a little bit, maybe 80% of the current height, still remaining usable on an iPhone 5S.
The vertical track size is zoomable on the iPhone, so we're not running into problems IMHO.
Removing the elegant darker window behind the green time/beat counter on the iPhone would open more space for the numbers.

What do others think?

I'm not sure. I like the big buttons for my fat fingers. Maybe a compromise might be to have a "selectable option" for the size or to hide the bar? I use an iPhone 7+ and I can't imagine how those with smaller screens would be able to use the app with graphics any smaller. But then again, I can imagine that they would also want as much space as possible.......so........ I'm ok as long as it's an option that can be set in preferences.

Very true, that's why I'm asking.
My reference is the built-in iOS keyboard keys: Buttons shall never get smaller than these, no, in fact they have to be larger than the ones in device portrait mode.

Matt_Fletcher_2000

@dwrae said:

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:
2. For some very annoying reason both my Lightblock and the Aftertouch app are not having their midi notes heard or recorded when AEM is connected to their ‘Lightblock Bluetooth port’ or ‘Aftertouch Source port’ respectively. Pitchbend, Aftertouch and cc74 (slide) are all being picked up and recorded. But just not the damn notes!

This is still in 2.0.2?

Ignore the Aftertouch app. I think that might be an issue with its own midi output port not sending midi at all.

But yes, the Roli Lightblock midi port is not working with v2.0.2 of AEM for me. However it works when connected to from other apps such as Animoog, MidiFlow etc. EDIT: To confirm, when I say, 'not working' it's very strange - AEM picks up and records pitch bend, ccs and pressure, but not any actual midi notes.

dwrae

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:
But yes, the Roli Lightblock midi port is not working with v2.0.2 of AEM for me. However it works when connected to from other apps such as Animoog, MidiFlow etc. EDIT: To confirm, when I say, 'not working' it's very strange - AEM picks up and records pitch bend, ccs and pressure, but not any actual midi notes.

I cannot think of anything that would cause it since it doesn't do filtering (except for the channel pressure previously). Do you have other BT or MIDI keyboards that do work?

gregsmith

@dwrae said:

@gregsmith said:
Ah yes seems to work with au effects but not au instruments. That’s very cool though and is probably all I’ll ever need tbh.

Next version will have parameter automation for au instruments as well

Wow! You’re clearly working super hard on this. Thanks for being so responsive.

dwrae

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:
But yes, the Roli Lightblock midi port is not working with v2.0.2 of AEM for me. However it works when connected to from other apps such as Animoog, MidiFlow etc. EDIT: To confirm, when I say, 'not working' it's very strange - AEM picks up and records pitch bend, ccs and pressure, but not any actual midi notes.

Is it the first or the third one here?

https://www.thomann.de/nl/roli_computer_controller_etc.html

Matt_Fletcher_2000

@dwrae said:

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:
But yes, the Roli Lightblock midi port is not working with v2.0.2 of AEM for me. However it works when connected to from other apps such as Animoog, MidiFlow etc. EDIT: To confirm, when I say, 'not working' it's very strange - AEM picks up and records pitch bend, ccs and pressure, but not any actual midi notes.

Is it the first or the third one here?

https://www.thomann.de/nl/roli_computer_controller_etc.html

The first one. It’s the Lightblock M (which is the newest version).

It’s definitely filtering notes out. But it is recording polyphonic key pressure. So maybe it’s something to do with them conflicting?

However when I put the lightblock midi through midi-flow, AEM then plays/records notes, but not pressure data. So that’s why I’m wondering if there’s some kind of connection between note and pressure data..

I have a Korg NanoStudio Keys Bluetooth controller at work. I can try that when I get time.

Janosax

Four iPhone sequencers and their timeline/toolbars layout/screen use:

dwrae

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:
I have a Korg NanoStudio Keys Bluetooth controller at work. I can try that when I get time.

I ordered one, should be here tomorrow.

Matt_Fletcher_2000

@dwrae said:

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:
I have a Korg NanoStudio Keys Bluetooth controller at work. I can try that when I get time.

I ordered one, should be here tomorrow.

Wow. Thanks!

It’s a great piece of kit I think.