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O.T.: An extraordinarily dark day in American history...

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Comments

  • @ExAsperis99 said:
    You know what? This column gets it right:

    No Sympathy for the Hillbilly
    Democrats need to stop trying to feel everyone’s pain, and hold on to their own anger.

    Let’s stop pretending that if we read cynical best sellers like Hillbilly Elegy in book clubs and empathic magazine and newspaper interviews by mainstream journalists with those Trump-loving “folks” in diners and bars that we’ll suddenly unearth some conscience that isn’t there. Let’s stop taking seriously NeverTrumpers like David Brooks who as recently as August enthused about the “intellectual ferment” in the Republican party and touted to Times readers four senators who embody the “post-2020, post-Trump Republican future”: Josh Hawley, Marco Rubio, Tom Cotton, and Ben Sasse. (No Black men need apply, of course.)

    This reminds me of something that someone pointed out the other day. There are tropes that have entered public discourse without reflection about what they really signify.

    For example, the notion that "rural" voters are generally more conservative -- by virtue of being "rural". It was pointed out that the degree to which "rural" areas are more conservative is the degree to which those people fall into categories that have nothing to do with being rural: education, ethnicity, religious affiliation. And, it turns out that "rural" amounts to "white". White rural voters and their black neighbors do not have the same political leaning. What is significant is not the rurality.

    The other trope is notions that "the Heartland" is somehow more American than where the vast majority of the population lives. It somehow gives weight to the notion that a romanticized version of America is the real America -- that the images from popular literature and movies of hard-working white farmers or white factory workers -- is a truer America than the one that most Americans live in. It plays into the historical bias of our governance structure -- disproportionate power of sparsely populated portions of the country. It ignores the terrible unfairness that that achieved that structure and population distribution.

    Rural America is not more American than urban and suburban America. Real America was not a part of the iconography established in the arts (books, paintings, movies) and so disproportionate weight gets given to an imagined picture of real America.

  • The ultimately perceivable reality of anything is ultimately existentially terrifying.

  • ...or love. Yah, go with love.

  • Love is terrifying...

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  • @TheOriginalPaulB said:
    The whole who’s left, who’s right thing does somewhat depend on where you’re standing in the lineup...

    That's not really my intent. What's described as 'the left' in the US by media and Republicans in reality encompasses what in most European countries would encompass everything from moderately right wing parties to the communist party. The only reason that doesn't happen in the US is that the political system is antiquated, broken and pretty undemocratic.

    There is no left wing party in the US for complex historical reasons. There is a left wing media (e.g. the Nation), but it's fairly small compared to what you see in Germany, Italy, France, etc.

    Vox just doesn't happen to be one of them - nor do I think Vox's editorial team would think of themselves as on the left. It just gets really annoying when right wingers describe everyone to their left as 'left wing', or seem to imagine that noted millionaire and fan of private enterprise, 'Nancy Pelosi', is somehow 'left wing'. On economic issues the gap between Bernie Sanders & Nancy Pelosi is far larger than the one between her and the Republican party.

  • @BladeRunner said:
    LMFAO.
    It sure is easy to get some folks riled up around here. It seems that the sensitive musician types are a little to sensitive.

    I mean we just did see the president try to orchestrate a putsch, but sure I guess...

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  • @espiegel123

    What about the book “White Fragility” do you find so objectionable that it raises someone in your esteem if they hate the book?

    Because the book is stupid, bizarrely racist and horrifying.

    Stupid. Her egregious misreading of MLK's I have a dream speech, or weird take on Jackie Robinson (she seems to think that white people think he's celebrated because he was the first black guy to be good enough to play baseball), total lack of awareness of any of the sociological/historical analysis of race/racism. Her analysis of racism seems to be that it's inescapable and maybe, I dunno, genetic? If you're white you're just racist, you can't help it and you should apologise to all the black people you know.

    Horrifying. Her description of her consulting work which reminds me of books I've written on cults. As a white person you're supposed to admit your evil and confess your sins. I mean... maybe don't do that? The only reasons I can see for her belief that white people are uncomfortable around racial issues are that: a) she's clearly uncomfortable around them and b) her weird groups sessions make people incredibly uncomfortable c) she's a weirdo who doesn't do human very well.

    Racist: The way in which she removes agency from Jackie Robinson (he was allowed to play baseball by white people in her odd telling of it). The way she constructs this concept of 'white' and 'black' as this inviolate thing that's just there apparently. Or even that she thinks race is a physical thing, rather than an ideological thing which emerged out of material and historical conditions (and which is different in other places. British racism is not the same as American racism, for example). The way that she seems to think that any kind of interracial mixing is impossible because of the unavoidable racism that she believes in (I guess my neighbors should get a divorce then).

    There are other things I hate about it too (sloppy scholarship, lack of any historical awareness, terrible writing)...

  • @Max23 said:
    https://boingboing.net/2021/01/11/melanie-trumps-tone-deaf-statement-praising-dead-coup-rioters-is-a-master-class-in-narcissistic-indignation.html

    "from people who are looking to be relevant and have an agenda."

    :D thats very interesting words out of that mouth :D :s

    Lord let it rain brains.

    ...and hearts...

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  • @Max23 said:

    @michael_m said:

    @Max23 said:
    https://boingboing.net/2021/01/11/melanie-trumps-tone-deaf-statement-praising-dead-coup-rioters-is-a-master-class-in-narcissistic-indignation.html

    "from people who are looking to be relevant and have an agenda."

    :D thats very interesting words out of that mouth :D :s

    Lord let it rain brains.

    ...and hearts...

    excuse me, thats really beyond satirical :D
    that woman is to stupid to turn the lights off. :D

    heartless?
    I have more

    "This time is solely about healing our country and its citizens."
    (yeah, so we dropped the bomb. now its time for healing. huh?)

    "It should not be used for personal gain."
    (All you are doing right now honey is for your personal gains.)

    you see, she is stupid as fuck and is lying to the people :#

    They all need to take a trip to see the Great and Mighty Oz

  • @cian said:
    @espiegel123

    What about the book “White Fragility” do you find so objectionable that it raises someone in your esteem if they hate the book?

    Because the book is stupid, bizarrely racist and horrifying.

    Stupid. Her egregious misreading of MLK's I have a dream speech, or weird take on Jackie Robinson (she seems to think that white people think he's celebrated because he was the first black guy to be good enough to play baseball), total lack of awareness of any of the sociological/historical analysis of race/racism. Her analysis of racism seems to be that it's inescapable and maybe, I dunno, genetic? If you're white you're just racist, you can't help it and you should apologise to all the black people you know.

    Horrifying. Her description of her consulting work which reminds me of books I've written on cults. As a white person you're supposed to admit your evil and confess your sins. I mean... maybe don't do that? The only reasons I can see for her belief that white people are uncomfortable around racial issues are that: a) she's clearly uncomfortable around them and b) her weird groups sessions make people incredibly uncomfortable c) she's a weirdo who doesn't do human very well.

    Racist: The way in which she removes agency from Jackie Robinson (he was allowed to play baseball by white people in her odd telling of it). The way she constructs this concept of 'white' and 'black' as this inviolate thing that's just there apparently. Or even that she thinks race is a physical thing, rather than an ideological thing which emerged out of material and historical conditions (and which is different in other places. British racism is not the same as American racism, for example). The way that she seems to think that any kind of interracial mixing is impossible because of the unavoidable racism that she believes in (I guess my neighbors should get a divorce then).

    There are other things I hate about it too (sloppy scholarship, lack of any historical awareness, terrible writing)...

    Forgive me: Have you read this book? Or are you only going to parrot the John McWhorter takedown of “White Fragility” in The Atlantic?

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    @ExAsperis99 said:
    Forgive me: Have you read this book?

    I read it in 2019 when somebody left it at my house. It's been doing the rounds for a while.

    Or are you only going to parrot the John McWhorter takedown of “White Fragility” in The Atlantic?

    I haven't read the review. If he said similar things then I guess we agree. I remember reading something Matt Taibbi wrote about the book and agreeing with it. I suppose it's possible I'm unconsciously parroting him, though I hated the book long before Taibbi wrote anything on it.

  • Please see the bottom of the page

  • Looks like it’s getting heated in here. Just ignore people if they upset you on this forum. It’s for music anyway.

    What an awful day. It was obvious to anyone it was coming. Nobody should be surprised. The people that could have prevented this did nothing years ago and did nothing as it was happening. Many of those that enabled this will do nothing moving forward as well. I’m a United States citizen. I’ve been living this nightmare for a while and it’s clear a large portion of our country supports this kind of behavior. It’s crazy.

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  • Pompeo will launch an investigation? I wonder what the record for simultaneous investigations is in a presidential term? Surely this one has shattered that. If only the investigations ever turned anything up, besides the dollar amount of legal bills.

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  • It's alright, ma, we're only bleeding...

  • @Max23 said:
    Mike Pence focused on showing the world the US has a "functioning government"
    "Need to telegraph to our allies and adversaries that we have a fully functioning government,"

    sounds good :s
    I feel so much better now. /s

    Do you have a Telegraph to receive the message? If not, what’s a good Telegraph app? And is that an intro price?

  • @Max23 said:
    lets look what the pigs in space do

    fox news headlines

    Democrats reframe Capitol riots as race issue
    Fox News hasn't seen the nazis pfff

    instead they have this other headline

    Antifa marches through NYC as fears of political violence heighten
    pfff

    Why don’t they just it it over with and rename themselves Völkischer Beobachter already?

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  • @Max23 said:

    @michael_m said:

    @Max23 said:
    lets look what the pigs in space do

    fox news headlines

    Democrats reframe Capitol riots as race issue
    Fox News hasn't seen the nazis pfff

    instead they have this other headline

    Antifa marches through NYC as fears of political violence heighten
    pfff

    Why don’t they just it it over with and rename themselves Völkischer Beobachter already?

    I dont know. Its completely obvious what is going on.

    I don’t think they are oblivious. I think they are remaining aligned to their cause as they know they can attract readers while the Trump cult still exists.

  • edited January 2021

    Trump fancies himself as King of America and he’s made the deal with the devil looking for support of the dark forces from people who were left behind by globalisation and rampant capitalism. I don’t think there is a way to put the genie back in the bottle but I think it will take at least another 20-40 years before things will start shifting in any considerable way.
    Yes, storming of the Capitol was shocking but I don’t think there is enough anger to provoke any major shift. For now it looks like a bunch bored red necks swinging flags for their Facebook and Instagram friends.
    I think there is a good chance DT will get impeached but unlikely while he’s still in office.

    Of course it doesn’t take a genius to predict that Biden won’t do two terms because of age. Now, will Harris be the first female president or are we going to have another republican Easter egg? I’ll be there ready with my popcorn.

This discussion has been closed.