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Comments
The main thing is that these sounds require mpe 'pressure' - channel aftertouch - to be triggered. If a midi source doesn't send that, it can't make it do anything. It's the same reason you can't trigger Fundamental with regular midi notes. As mentioned though, the Audio Modeling app coming some months down the line will be capable of this.
@McD 'Waiting for Drambot' , 😂, nice.
Don't forget the value of pitch bends to allow vibrato and portamento gestures.
I almost bought a 3D Touch Phone this week just to get ready for the full monty of "pressure"
gestures which I expect will be mapped to MIDI velocities. I have never dug into after touch
because I never owned a synth that had it. But I expect it's the pressure sensitivity to invoke a per note
Modulation control versus the mod wheel that applies to all active notes.
There isn't an iPad that supports 3D Touch. Apple didn't get enough take-up to make it a standard feature. They might re-visit it in the future if a competitive platform does and
they need to compete.
Sure, aftertouch is just one of the 5 aspects of mpe, I'm only mentioning that in this case it is the lack of that specific feature which is the reason this won't work with regular midi. Of course pitch bends etc are other important aspects.
5? Do tell. Do iPads support most of the 5 as a control surface?
The real hardware devices: Roli, etc are all a bridge too far price wise for me
but I could be convinced by a good reply to buy something and let my inner
Yo-Yo Ma out.
Here's a simple explanation, McD, though it uses Roli terminology - which personally I like as it is the clearest language for this.
https://rolisupport.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/articles/36000019157-what-is-5d-touch-
Mpe synths are hit and miss on iOS as to how far they implement all of these, sadly. Particularly, a lot do nothing interesting with release velocity ('lift' in Roli terms). There are also a lot of problems with Bluetooth mpe - stuck notes being the main one. I've had aot of problems with this with the Roli Seaboard. It can be hard to tell whether the problems come from the synth or the controller. Mpe is beautiful, you would absolutely love it, I think, but can be frustrating to work with.
Yes, they will be compatible with ANY MIDI controller, including MPE devices
I know you are disappointed. I'm sorry for that.
What I can say is that making such complex products available on iOS is not an easy task. There are always issues behind the corner, and if we evaluate that products are not ready to be released, we will not release them, even if we estimated a shorter development time. We want to protect users from bad experience and frustration in using a non finalized, unreliable product.
As said many times, our roadmap is not a promise, it is just a day by day confidence with our community.
Regarding the decision to integrate SWAM in GeoShred, we are really really happy. Indeed velocity is supported on Y-axis and Expression can be controlled by the Expression pad or by a custom Fader. The GeoShred keyboard is really powerful and expressive for many music styles.
If it does not fit your way to play, I do not see any problem, simply that's not for you. Just wait for the native iPad version of SWAM and you will be able to connect any MIDI controller.
Best!
Emanuele
Will users who only have the basic ‘play’ version need to upgrade to use the swam gear, or will it be the same iaa deal as it is currently?
GeoShred Play Users will be able to purchase Geo-SWAM instruments as IAPs. Each Geo-SWAM instrument comes with 10 presets. If you wish to create your own presets, use MIDI/MPE or the AUv3 Plugin you can also upgrade GeoShred Play to the functionality of GeoShred Pro.
Cheers, good to know 🙏
Ok I’m ready!
leaves non-constructive comment only to subscribe to thread
Have you tried any of the 3D touch capable phones with any MPE apps? Is it worth the $200 to pick up one of these phones for a cheap controller and an extra IOS "pocket" computer?
I still have a couple previous iPhones including an iPhone 6S which has the 3D Touch feature. I’ve been holding on to this one just for the MPE stuff. Just need to have the cracked screen fixed ughh...
Edited to correct
Btw, I’m pretty sure you could find one cheaper than $200. No?
My seven has 3D Touch, I think the big one has it too...
You’re right, I was just looking, and apparently it survived all the way up to the 8, 8S, X, and XS
Now those are still pulling in $200 in most examples
I haven't. But to be honest, it's hard to beat a physical controller for this. I went through a phase where I thought Velocity Keyboard could replace my Seaboard, but I have changed my mind. Though if your keyboard skills are already rock solid, a 3D phone might serve you well enough.
Interesting, I didn’t know any of the x series had it, that might be something worth upgrading to at some point as I’d like one with a radar camera for 3D scanning at some point, ta!
FOR THE RECORD - 5 MPE Controller Parameters:
Touch - usually mapped to MIDI velocity/volume
Press - aftertouch/pressure on surface (needs 3D Touch, I think)
Slide - left/right ley/pad movements - mapped to pitch bends typically - often a ribbon
Glide - up/down key/pad movements
Lift - velocity of the finger lift motion
MPE pitch bends change the limits to +/- 2 octaves as I recall.
Does that look useful/correct?
Yup! Pressure is the key, iPads can't do it. Velocity Keyboard kind of does it based on finger radius, but can't quite rival an actual device for sensitivity. I really wish Apple would bring 3D touch to ipad, but since they've abandoned it on phones, that looks unlikely.
I wonder how useful pen2bow would be to supply the velocity? It uses the Apple Pencil which has some method of supplying velocity.
Any 3D Touch users here that can advise on MPE response on their phones?
On Xs, the pressure measurement is very good. It seems able to detect correctly and almost instantaneously the 127 different levels of pressure.
Been using a new 6S for six months or so ... not full MPE but interesting on some apps and synths. Adds an extra "push" to synths like animoog, model d, volt and the ifretlesses.
BUT ... toobloody small to give you much control or expression.... no wiggle room! Maybe it's my chronically analog fingers but I need to put some muscle into it.
Need something like Ribbons or tc11 to design some usable real estate really... not a teensy weensy toy keyboard. An interesting control surface rather than a bonsai-ed keyboard.
Be patient and dilligent McD... You can score a good as new (untouched) Roli Rise 25 on ebay for twice the price of a new 6s phone on the same site. Seriously. I know cos I just got one a couple of months back for $700 in Australian play money.Haven't touched anything else since. Specially when I hooked it up with the ipads wonderful little synths.
Yee haa!!!... and no comparison with the phone whatsoever.
https://support.roli.com/support/solutions/folders/36000169817
The Xs max may be the best option (best CPU, greatest size).
Or you could take an older/cheaper « max » 3D Touch iPhone to control via Bluetooth a recent iPad Air 4 / pro generating the sound.
India bros got early access? > @moForte said:
Will the feedback feature work for these SWAM instruments? For example, I really like the feedback on the factory Nasty Boy patch--can I get that on say a cello or oboe sound?
1 out of 2.
That's about $500 for me in the USA.
OK. Never mind.
Phone too small and Roli out of reach.
A Seaboard Block is about 200 dollars new I think, no? Not that expensive. But it's literally just two octaves. So you'd probably want two. Everyone says the Rise is a better bit of kit than the Block btw. But yeah, I think a phone is really small to do expressive playing on. Not saying it's not possible, but I wouldn't imagine it's anywhere near as enjoyable to use as an actual controller.
I just wandered how well Midi Guitar 2 would work? Does it output sufficient midi control data to make it a good way to control the SWAM instruments? I suppose with the addition of an external breath controller you’d have a similar amount of control and flexibility using an iPad as you would on a PC or Mac, am I right? I can play keyboards, but I am primarily a guitarist, so this would be great if it worked well.