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Haha I’m happy to be wrong about that one lol
I will try and let you know.
It’s likely that the release noise “general” volume be modulated by the CC message, itself continuously modulated by other note off events occurring after. But I am not certain this would be a real problem : after all it’s only about releases noises. A bit of randomness cannot hurt.
Just install the free demo and you will see.
Stage license gives you 2 instrument packs, one of which could be the E-piano.
And now the question: if I do this, what can I tweak in this Stage Electric Piano pack version?
That's my question!
Success! I converted velocity to CC and I'm seeing a dramatic difference in key release noise now.
It seems the CC message is tweaking the general release volume on each keypress; I can watch the slider for 'Key Release Noise' and see it readjust after each key press. As you said, I think reason it works is you're adjusting the general release volume for each note. There is a big difference, still think Modartt's compromise might be affecting things a little bit, though, e.g., harder to get loud noise, I think, if you've held note down a long time. Even if so, no real randomness, just slightly altered by Modartt algorithm.
EDIT: A small snafu: it seems the new key release noise value is always delayed one note. So it won't work perfectly if you alternate, e.g., between 1. 'hard release', 2.'soft release', 3. 'hard release', 4. 'soft release'. Because the volume for release 2 is set by release 1, release 3 is set by release 2, etc. Haven't tested playing real keyboard, but doubt that this is major issue. Not perfect, but an improvement, I think. Maybe adding delay before Note Off sent could fix it, haven't checked.
Here is sample of code I used in Mozaic, after adding midi entry to Pianoteq to modulate key release noise with CC 68:
It's been answered already many times in this thread, thus hesitance to write it out once again. Also, it's hard to give a good idea of it in words, anyway, much better to just download and try, if you're interested. The demo itself is useful enough that many people have used it for months/years without ever buying Pianoteq.
Hmm, I see.
This is because you need first to block the incoming note off, then modify the CC value and finally send the note off event previously blocked.
Maybe converting the noteOff with velocity into a noteOff without velocity might help. A one millisecond delay might help too.
So here is my own version with Streambyter.
By default, the CC value is sent on CC68 but that can be changed to another CC with the CC_OUT slider.
Like you, I notice that PianoTeq is always applying an internal processing for the release noise depending mostly on the note duration. The shorter the duration, the closer the noise is from your CC value. The longer the duration, the more internal processing is applied (which tends to lower the volume). So even if you note off velocity is 127, a long note will produce almost no release noise.
That's effectively what the Mozaic code does (Note Off isn't sent until unblocked in 'SendMidiThru'), without need for an explicit 'Block', which doesn't exist in Mozaic. I still observe it doesn't actually alter release volume until next note, even if I delay the note-off message for 500ms after the CC.. Are you sure your Streambyter code affects current note?
0 velocity Note Off makes no difference; I was testing with AUM internal keyboard that always sends 0 velocity, generating CC values in Mozaic.
Yes, repeated observations are very consistent.
I think it’s okay with this script.
I think if you're testing using a keyboard that sends Note Off velocity you might not hear the issue. I've been generating artificial values to make it more obvious. Like I said, the Mozaic code I'm using blocks implicitly. I can literally see the Key Release Noise slider change 500ms before the Note Off itself gets processed. Could be something else I'm not realizing in my own code, I guess. But I still suspect you just don't hear the issue because it's not as apparent if you're using keyboard that's sending naturally generated Note Off velocity values. That would actually be a good thing.
Pianoteq 8 Stage giveaway live in the AUv3 Facebook group 👀
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1704410769839550/permalink/3536491733298102/?mibextid=DcJ9fc
The picker-wheel will face 'entry overload'
No doubt 😂🤣😂
Man this thing is good (still working my way through the demos).
I’ve been a huge fan of Neo Soul Keys and Ravenscroft for years but the pianos, Rhodes and Wurlis in Pianoteq are just unreal (not to mention the vibes, celesta and Hohner packs).
Unfortunately I get a lot of crackles on my iPad Pro 10.5 (my iPhone 12 Mini seems to be fine).
I truly hope that there will still be a healthy market for the likes of NSK, RC275 and Module long after PT8 has established itself, but it is becoming hard to resist splurging the £££.
My iPad Pro 10.5 is fine, and many people have reported good results with slower machines. My iPad Pro 10.5 gives a 'Performance Index' in low 70's, which is generally fine for even pretty complex playing. Many people use machines with half that or lower as a perf rating.
Try going to 'Options', 'Perf' page to check performance. Make sure 'multicore rendering' is checked, and try checking 'Keep CPU busy' to see if it makes a difference. Try experimenting with buffer size on 'Options', 'Devices' page. I've run it at 64 samples and when playing the default 'Blues Demo' it gives perf rating of around 72. 'Current polyphony' on perf page doesn't get very high with that Blues Demo. You can watch cpu usage graph and see that song is not stressing the machine at all. Try downloading some classical music midi and running it; it will have much higher polyphony if it does lots of sustain, will stress things more; you should be able to avoid crackles by lowering maximum polyphony. Or just try recording a bit of running your finger up and down keyboard with sustain pedal on. I just did that, got polyphony up over 100 for short bursts, didn't notice any crackles.
I hope Modartt also put Organteq on iOS too, it sounds phenomenal. The sound give me goosebumps.
Works well in stand-alone mode on my lower spec machine, iPad 5th Gen (A9 Twister) running iOS 14.8, as a piano module for instance. Gets hard on the processor if more than one instance though.
I also have an iPad 9th Gen but I have mainly used it as a piano module so far on both machines.
It does sound phenomenal but that is a very niche product, and apparently it is hard to play any kind of convincing church organ - whether there are good workarounds or it really matters, I don't know. But church organ emulation is very unique, I dunno!
Tbh, I can't honestly hope that there is still a market for inferior products (the Korg Module sampled pianos are extemely lacking compared to Pianoteq).
I would much rather that people abandon sample-based stuff in droves and we get more physical modeling stuff instead, either from existing ios devs or from desktop devs like Modartt paying superb attention to detail in their porting (only the preset drop down menus are a huge letdown for me, otherwise, what a great implementation).
With physical modeling, the sound is better, it's much more flexible (or can be - Modartt have done a better job on that area than Audio Modeling), and very importantly for iOS, they take up so much less space!
Devs need to change with the times. The future of real world instruments emulations is physically modeled, not sample based, imo.
My « complaints » so far :
Yeah, drop down menu is really a disaster - please wrote to them and tell them that. I've mentioned it, but the more the merrier. It's a stain on an otherwise excellent app
What?? That would be amazing. I love a good Organ and didn’t even know this existed. I’m iOS only though so I guess I’ll wait. The GSI organ apps are fantastic though. Wish they had a tonewheel and pipe/cathedral one though. Blue3 sounds promising but I already have Galileo 2 and HaNon.
Definitely going to be doing that. That’s the one thing about it that annoys me.
Is Organteq a cathedral organ only? Or does it do Vox, Farfisa, etc as well? I really like the GSI apps for that and they’re done with physical modeling!
I do kinda agree with your last point. I think Module will stick around because of all the other sounds+ Gadget fans. And I’ll keep PSP on my iPad for other sounds like woodwinds, choirs, etc (and the synth part obviously). Pure Piano and Numa, I’m undecided. I love the pad sounds in PP but do I really need it now? Idk. I do know I want more physical modeling on iOS.
Where to do so? And is there a consensus on the best implementation that can be given as a reference? I find many of not most AUv3 lose the mojo in the preset area. I like Model D implementation as well as King of FM.
The AudioKit stuff is a pretty good reference. Bleass as well.
Open Pianoteq. Choose ‘options’ on top right. Choose ‘About’ on bottom left. Choose ‘feedback and bug reports’ on the bottom.
Yeah, strangely, so many devs can’t seem to implement a decent preset menu. I can think of a lot of shit ones offhand, but few good ones.
Yeah, the model 15 preset menu does look pretty good. Some things a good preset manager needs:
Easy batch import and export
Ideally presets should be exposed in the files system
Unless the app exposes presets to the files system, it absolutely MUST have a way of importing presets that is internal to the app. For example, Virsyn Tera Pro does not have this feature. In theory, you should be able to click on a zip of exported presets in Files, then choose Tera Pro as a destination. But due to bugs in the Apple share menu (still?!!!! WTF!) Tera Pro does not always appear. As a consequence I have been unable to install a preset pack DMT Cymatics sent me.
Ability to scroll and choose the preset you want without accidentally selecting something you didn’t want to select - Pianoteq is a nightmare in this regard
Easy ability to create, order, name and rename your own banks
Any attempt to save should always be a ‘save as’ offering a chance to name the preset. If you have modified an existing preset, that name should appear and you should be free to overwrite it or edit it. Pianoteq is bad in this regard. Pressing Save will completely overwrite the original preset without offering a ‘save as’ function. For a ‘save as’ option you need to long press on the save button: totally unintuitive. They are aware of this problem.
Warning prompt if you try to overwrite a factory preset or one of your own with the same name it had before you tweaked it.
In the case of Pianoteq, a user might want to save tweaks on an instrument in a user subcategory of that instrument’s folder (eg the Steinway NY D folder, rather than a totally separate Steinway NY D folder)
Anything I have missed?
The good news is that Modartt seems to be very aware that their iOS port is still perfectible. They warned me to always download the latest version, etc.
My guess is they will also realize that they love the app as much as (if not more) the desktop version. So they will polish it more and more while heading to version 9.
They seem very responsive. Some fixes out already. I can definitely think of desktop devs who have been MUCH slower to react to feedback from ios users after porting, even for quite trivial things, or ones who just take forever to reply to messages, if they ever even do reply. I'm impressed with Modartt. They already updated sections of the manual which had desktop shortcuts to show the ios workarounds within a day or two of my asking for that.