My thoughts on Logic Pro 2 weeks post release...

Gavinski

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@richardyot said:
I think the Mixer window is the most frustrating UI element. You set your Mixer to full-screen, open a plugin which then shrinks the Mixer window down, and then when you exit the plugin the Mixer window is tiny so you have to resize it/maximise it. Even on a 12.9 that can get irritating.

As a result I'm more inclined to select the plugins in the arranger view via the plugin tiles, at least then there isn't that constant need to resize the windows when you exit the plugin.

This too, although this wasn't as big of an issue for me personally . But, at the end of the day, I still like how quick it is for me to master in Logic Pro. And Logic Pro seems to detect the latency of my airpods and automatically lines up the vocals for me the couple times I've tried vocal recording. Miraculous.

Yeah, initially realising I needed to always drag to get the mixer sliders to open up properly was quite a shock. That did strike me as bad design for sure

jwmmakerofmusic

@Gavinski said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@richardyot said:
I think the Mixer window is the most frustrating UI element. You set your Mixer to full-screen, open a plugin which then shrinks the Mixer window down, and then when you exit the plugin the Mixer window is tiny so you have to resize it/maximise it. Even on a 12.9 that can get irritating.

As a result I'm more inclined to select the plugins in the arranger view via the plugin tiles, at least then there isn't that constant need to resize the windows when you exit the plugin.

This too, although this wasn't as big of an issue for me personally . But, at the end of the day, I still like how quick it is for me to master in Logic Pro. And Logic Pro seems to detect the latency of my airpods and automatically lines up the vocals for me the couple times I've tried vocal recording. Miraculous.

Yeah, initially realising I needed to always drag to get the mixer sliders to open up properly was quite a shock. That did strike me as bad design for sure

I'm sure a lot of this stuff will be fine-tuned in the future. Logic Pro for iPad is a rebuilt-from-the-ground-up version of the OG Logic Pro, so I'm assuming Apple will continue to fine tune things.

realdawei

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@Gavinski said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@richardyot said:
I think the Mixer window is the most frustrating UI element. You set your Mixer to full-screen, open a plugin which then shrinks the Mixer window down, and then when you exit the plugin the Mixer window is tiny so you have to resize it/maximise it. Even on a 12.9 that can get irritating.

As a result I'm more inclined to select the plugins in the arranger view via the plugin tiles, at least then there isn't that constant need to resize the windows when you exit the plugin.

This too, although this wasn't as big of an issue for me personally . But, at the end of the day, I still like how quick it is for me to master in Logic Pro. And Logic Pro seems to detect the latency of my airpods and automatically lines up the vocals for me the couple times I've tried vocal recording. Miraculous.

Yeah, initially realising I needed to always drag to get the mixer sliders to open up properly was quite a shock. That did strike me as bad design for sure

I'm sure a lot of this stuff will be fine-tuned in the future. Logic Pro for iPad is a rebuilt-from-the-ground-up version of the OG Logic Pro, so I'm assuming Apple will continue to fine tune things.

Learned in one of the dev sessions that Swift was used to some extent in Logic and Final Cut for iPad…that’s gutsy

jwmmakerofmusic

@realdawei said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@Gavinski said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@richardyot said:
I think the Mixer window is the most frustrating UI element. You set your Mixer to full-screen, open a plugin which then shrinks the Mixer window down, and then when you exit the plugin the Mixer window is tiny so you have to resize it/maximise it. Even on a 12.9 that can get irritating.

As a result I'm more inclined to select the plugins in the arranger view via the plugin tiles, at least then there isn't that constant need to resize the windows when you exit the plugin.

This too, although this wasn't as big of an issue for me personally . But, at the end of the day, I still like how quick it is for me to master in Logic Pro. And Logic Pro seems to detect the latency of my airpods and automatically lines up the vocals for me the couple times I've tried vocal recording. Miraculous.

Yeah, initially realising I needed to always drag to get the mixer sliders to open up properly was quite a shock. That did strike me as bad design for sure

I'm sure a lot of this stuff will be fine-tuned in the future. Logic Pro for iPad is a rebuilt-from-the-ground-up version of the OG Logic Pro, so I'm assuming Apple will continue to fine tune things.

Learned in one of the dev sessions that Swift was used to some extent in Logic and Final Cut for iPad…that’s gutsy

That's rather interesting. Well, no matter what was used, so long as they continue to fine-tune the product to make it more enjoyable to use for music creation, that's what counts for me. I will stay subbed to Logic Pro for its amazing capabilities regarding recording, mixing, and mastering.

Luxthor

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@realdawei said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@Gavinski said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@richardyot said:
I think the Mixer window is the most frustrating UI element. You set your Mixer to full-screen, open a plugin which then shrinks the Mixer window down, and then when you exit the plugin the Mixer window is tiny so you have to resize it/maximise it. Even on a 12.9 that can get irritating.

As a result I'm more inclined to select the plugins in the arranger view via the plugin tiles, at least then there isn't that constant need to resize the windows when you exit the plugin.

This too, although this wasn't as big of an issue for me personally . But, at the end of the day, I still like how quick it is for me to master in Logic Pro. And Logic Pro seems to detect the latency of my airpods and automatically lines up the vocals for me the couple times I've tried vocal recording. Miraculous.

Yeah, initially realising I needed to always drag to get the mixer sliders to open up properly was quite a shock. That did strike me as bad design for sure

I'm sure a lot of this stuff will be fine-tuned in the future. Logic Pro for iPad is a rebuilt-from-the-ground-up version of the OG Logic Pro, so I'm assuming Apple will continue to fine tune things.

Learned in one of the dev sessions that Swift was used to some extent in Logic and Final Cut for iPad…that’s gutsy

That's rather interesting. Well, no matter what was used, so long as they continue to fine-tune the product to make it more enjoyable to use for music creation, that's what counts for me. I will stay subbed to Logic Pro for its amazing capabilities regarding recording, mixing, and mastering.

They can use Swift for GUI or whatever they want as long as the critical components of the audio engine stay low level. Bitwig uses Java for GUI / plug-in management and everything is working just fine.

@realdawei, do you maybe remember what session you watched? I barely can find anything in ‘developer.app’.

klownshed

@ErrkaPetti said:

@klownshed said:
And in the spirit of positivity and calm (), here's a calming little orchestral-ey sountrack-ey type tune I made with my good friend and old bandmate in Logic. (on Mac, Can't get those strings on the iPad. Yet.).

Sounds nice!

The Strings you can’t bring to iPad, please tell us more what it is…

All the instruments used on this track are from Spitfire Audio.

ik2000

@klownshed said:
And in the spirit of positivity and calm (), here's a calming little orchestral-ey sountrack-ey type tune I made with my good friend and old bandmate in Logic. (on Mac, Can't get those strings on the iPad. Yet.).

This is really good… feel like I’m in a Nordic crime drama. Great strings and arrangement. What Spitfire libraries did you use?

Luxthor

@klownshed said:
And in the spirit of positivity and calm (), here's a calming little orchestral-ey sountrack-ey type tune I made with my good friend and old bandmate in Logic. (on Mac, Can't get those strings on the iPad. Yet.).

Listening while drinking morning coffee, approved! 👏 Now I need one more round. 👍

klownshed

@gregsmith @Schmotown @ErrkaPetti @ik2000 @Luxthor

Thank you, appreciate it :-)

@ik2000 yes “Nordic crime drama” is exactly what we were feeling whilst we made it. Hence the name :-) it helped us keep it focussed and to avoid the temptation to keep adding more stuff.

tahiche

I can’t believe how no one is complaining about this…

I must close the project while wanting to go up a level 5 times per session… so annoying. At least turn that “<“ into an “X” !.

ik2000

@tahiche said:
I can’t believe how no one is complaining about this…

I must close the project while wanting to go up a level 5 times per session… so annoying. At least turn that “<“ into an “X” !.

Think a few people have had the same experience - really bad UI design...

HotStrange

@ik2000 said:

@tahiche said:
I can’t believe how no one is complaining about this…

I must close the project while wanting to go up a level 5 times per session… so annoying. At least turn that “<“ into an “X” !.

Think a few people have had the same experience - really bad UI design...

Almost laughably bad. Not sure how that was overlooked.

Samu

@HotStrange said:

@ik2000 said:

@tahiche said:
I can’t believe how no one is complaining about this…

I must close the project while wanting to go up a level 5 times per session… so annoying. At least turn that “<“ into an “X” !.

Think a few people have had the same experience - really bad UI design...

Almost laughably bad. Not sure how that was overlooked.

I've never not even once during my entire time with Logic Pro for iPad accidentally tapped that 'thing'...
...I do intentional saves after adding and modifying AUv3's as I've had way too many crashes so a manual save is more or less a must.

Even though the 'auto save' can recover the plug-ins that were used their settings will be lost, unless a manual save was previously done...

HotStrange

@Samu said:

@HotStrange said:

@ik2000 said:

@tahiche said:
I can’t believe how no one is complaining about this…

I must close the project while wanting to go up a level 5 times per session… so annoying. At least turn that “<“ into an “X” !.

Think a few people have had the same experience - really bad UI design...

Almost laughably bad. Not sure how that was overlooked.

I've never not even once during my entire time with Logic Pro for iPad accidentally tapped that 'thing'...
...I do intentional saves after adding and modifying AUv3's as I've had way too many crashes so a manual save is more or less a must.

Even though the 'auto save' can recover the plug-ins that were used their settings will be lost, unless a manual save was previously done...

I’ve done it too many times to count 😂 definitely gonna have to get in the habit of saving more often in logic. You’re experiencing crashes? Can’t say I’ve had one yet.

Samu

@HotStrange said:

I’ve done it too many times to count 😂 definitely gonna have to get in the habit of saving more often in logic. You’re experiencing crashes? Can’t say I’ve had one yet.

Some AUv3's are quite crashy and editing or removing audio takes from a take-folder can sometimes make things go south.
But overall stability is quite ok. I can make every app I touch crash sooner or later so it's no indication of the apps stability under 'normal' usage

richardyot

@Samu said:

@HotStrange said:

@ik2000 said:

@tahiche said:
I can’t believe how no one is complaining about this…

I must close the project while wanting to go up a level 5 times per session… so annoying. At least turn that “<“ into an “X” !.

Think a few people have had the same experience - really bad UI design...

Almost laughably bad. Not sure how that was overlooked.

I've never not even once during my entire time with Logic Pro for iPad accidentally tapped that 'thing'...
...I do intentional saves after adding and modifying AUv3's as I've had way too many crashes so a manual save is more or less a must.

Even though the 'auto save' can recover the plug-ins that were used their settings will be lost, unless a manual save was previously done...

How do you do a "manual" save? Is it by exiting the project and re-opening it?

Janosax

For those complaining about resizing windows and I understand this perfectly, there is that double bar button which allows to toggle view to full size mixer, plug-in or editing views with a single tap. Have you tried it? It’s much better using it.

Janosax

I’ve reported the sluggish resizing issue to Mani Consulting Limited for iFretless bass. They say it’s about Logic doing some animation = it resizes the UI hundreds of times very quickly. It seems difficult to fix on their side, so Apple has something to do here. Issue also appears with CB3, but only when dragging UI edge, not when toggle plugin full view. Logic does this issue when dragging AND when toggle full size.

klownshed

@Janosax said:
For those complaining about resizing windows and I understand this perfectly, there is that double bar button which allows to toggle view to full size mixer, plug-in or editing views with a single tap. Have you tried it? It’s much better using it.

Here's a suggestion for Apple:

Double tap the pencil, knob and mixer buttons to go directly to full screen mode.

I don't have my iPad with me so I can't check to see if double tapping does anything now?

Samu

@richardyot said:

How do you do a "manual" save? Is it by exiting the project and re-opening it?

Yes, that's the way to do it.

ervin

@Samu said:

@richardyot said:

How do you do a "manual" save? Is it by exiting the project and re-opening it?

Yes, that's the way to do it.

"Professional DAW"

richardyot

@Janosax said:
For those complaining about resizing windows and I understand this perfectly, there is that double bar button which allows to toggle view to full size mixer, plug-in or editing views with a single tap. Have you tried it? It’s much better using it.

Yes I know about the single-tap on that little button, but the problem is that Logic doesn't then restore your maximised view if you open a plugin.

Here I have a full-screen mixer:

If I tap on one of the plugins to edit its settings, the plugin window opens and the Mixer window shrinks to accommodate it:

then when I exit the plugin, my Mixer window is squashed down at the bottom of the screen, so I have to maximise it again. If you need to edit several plugins in a chain this gets old pretty quick.

Janosax

@richardyot said:

@Janosax said:
For those complaining about resizing windows and I understand this perfectly, there is that double bar button which allows to toggle view to full size mixer, plug-in or editing views with a single tap. Have you tried it? It’s much better using it.

Yes I know about the single-tap on that little button, but the problem is that Logic doesn't then restore your maximised view if you open a plugin.

Here I have a full-screen mixer:

If I tap on one of the plugins to edit its settings, the plugin window opens and the Mixer window shrinks to accommodate it:

then when I exit the plugin, my Mixer window is squashed down at the bottom of the screen, so I have to maximise it again. If you need to edit several plugins in a chain this gets old pretty quick.

Sure. Like mentioned it’s better for now to edit plugins from tiles/arrangement view with mixer closed. Let’s hope they will improve that.

richardyot

@Janosax said:

@richardyot said:

@Janosax said:
For those complaining about resizing windows and I understand this perfectly, there is that double bar button which allows to toggle view to full size mixer, plug-in or editing views with a single tap. Have you tried it? It’s much better using it.

Yes I know about the single-tap on that little button, but the problem is that Logic doesn't then restore your maximised view if you open a plugin.

Here I have a full-screen mixer:

If I tap on one of the plugins to edit its settings, the plugin window opens and the Mixer window shrinks to accommodate it:

then when I exit the plugin, my Mixer window is squashed down at the bottom of the screen, so I have to maximise it again. If you need to edit several plugins in a chain this gets old pretty quick.

Sure. Like mentioned it’s better for now to edit plugins from tiles/arrangement view with mixer closed. Let’s hope they will improve that.

Yes that's what I've been doing as well, in the arranger/tiles view you don't have this problem.

RajahP

Thanks Apple.. it hit the spot…

Sweet.

ervin

@richardyot said:

Yes I know about the single-tap on that little button, but the problem is that Logic doesn't then restore your maximised view if you open a plugin.

I would bet money on this one being "usability testing totally found it and registered it, but product management said f*ck it, let them tap away, put it on the backlog for the next release" kind of usability defect.

Edward_Alexander

@Gavinski said:

@dendy said:
@klownshed

any chance you have 12.9” pro ? from screenshots it looks like on big screen the UI may be completely ok .. maybe problem is simply i have just Air .. on Air it’s endless frustrating resizing of windows most of time (during which it often crashes, that’s another topic). I really deeply not understand how this may be acceptable for somebody …

I can see how on 12.9” it may be very different experience

Personally on 12.9 I find the UI absolutely fine. The only thing is that it is a bit sluggish at times, opening auv3s full screen. I'm on an M1 so I can't imagine how much worse this could be on devices with older chips

I haven’t experienced any “sluggishness” at all, and I think I’m using the same hardware; 12.9” M1 w/1TB (16GB RAM)

Do you have the 1 or 2 TB model Gav? (I know the models with smaller storage sizes have only 8 GB)

Gavinski

Hey Ed, I have the 2TB model. Not sure why I might be experiencing this! @Edward_Alexander

Gavinski

@Edward_Alexander said:

@Gavinski said:

@dendy said:
@klownshed

any chance you have 12.9” pro ? from screenshots it looks like on big screen the UI may be completely ok .. maybe problem is simply i have just Air .. on Air it’s endless frustrating resizing of windows most of time (during which it often crashes, that’s another topic). I really deeply not understand how this may be acceptable for somebody …

I can see how on 12.9” it may be very different experience

Personally on 12.9 I find the UI absolutely fine. The only thing is that it is a bit sluggish at times, opening auv3s full screen. I'm on an M1 so I can't imagine how much worse this could be on devices with older chips

I haven’t experienced any “sluggishness” at all, and I think I’m using the same hardware; 12.9” M1 w/1TB (16GB RAM)

Do you have the 1 or 2 TB model Gav? (I know the models with smaller storage sizes have only 8 GB)

Check this (unlisted) vid using Beat Scholar:

Edward_Alexander

@Gavinski said:

@Edward_Alexander said:

@Gavinski said:

@dendy said:
@klownshed

any chance you have 12.9” pro ? from screenshots it looks like on big screen the UI may be completely ok .. maybe problem is simply i have just Air .. on Air it’s endless frustrating resizing of windows most of time (during which it often crashes, that’s another topic). I really deeply not understand how this may be acceptable for somebody …

I can see how on 12.9” it may be very different experience

Personally on 12.9 I find the UI absolutely fine. The only thing is that it is a bit sluggish at times, opening auv3s full screen. I'm on an M1 so I can't imagine how much worse this could be on devices with older chips

I haven’t experienced any “sluggishness” at all, and I think I’m using the same hardware; 12.9” M1 w/1TB (16GB RAM)

Do you have the 1 or 2 TB model Gav? (I know the models with smaller storage sizes have only 8 GB)

Check this (unlisted) vid using Beat Scholar:

Ah, but isn’t that just Beat Scholar itself being sluggish though? I saw it mentioned in the Beat Scholar thread that the app’s resizing features were having issues.

I haven’t tried Beat Scholar in Logic yet, but it’s on my todo list.